What Should I DO.

[BOB..DOLE]

I cant find my books on this one i am sure it was i.d capped off.
a.r isolate gas supply

so if a gas fire was a.r surly the gas needs to be isolated or capped.

 

[scatmanjohn]

if you have an at risk and a nts doesnt that make it an id.

No

 

[ollski]

if you have an at risk and a nts doesnt that make it an id.

Not unless they combine to make it an immediate danger to life or property.

 

[ollski]

so if a gas fire was a.r surly the gas needs to be isolated or capped.

No you turn it off and inform the customer there is a potential for a problem but that if they continue to use it it is at their own risk. As long as they have turned it on your responsibility lies only with the information you have provided them.

 

[corgiman]

I am going to check with the yappies on monday cos what you say goes against nearly fifteen years of training oll.

not saying your wrong but this is one that needs clarification a bit pronto like

 

[ollski]

No worries cm but since being told that by my my corgi guy I have checked the books (citb, viper, corgi) and cannot find anything other than that they should be turned off with customers permission.....which is good really as that is all I have ever done!.

 

[pannierstan]

when did that change olls???

I like BOB am under the impression that an AT RISK you MUST isolate the gas supply (not disconnect by isolate)

I have to agree.

Lets face it what is turning of the clock or fused spur gonna do when a customer wants heat.

I used to train engineers for ACS assessment and this argument could go on for hours.

When all said and done YOU are the person on the job. I personally still do turn off the appliance isolation and write that on the warning notice.
You are not a sparky you are a gas engineer
In this way the customer actually has to use a tool to reinstate the appliance not just brush up against a switch and say sorry didnt notice.

AR situations are far to often played down by engineers but its there for a reason even if the appliance has worked for the last 45 years

Its like the old Thumb tap and restrictor elbow without a cap or plug argument. One is AR and the other is ID why because you need a tool to open one, but not the other.

Stan

 

[ollski]

when did that change olls???

I like BOB am under the impression that an AT RISK you MUST isolate the gas supply (not disconnect by isolate)

I have to agree.

Lets face it what is turning of the clock or fused spur gonna do when a customer wants heat.

That's the whole point though at risk is something which MAY lead to a situation which MAY become a risk to life or property, you cannot stop a customer using that appliance if they want to, merely arm them with the information to make a decision.I can quote from viper:

'Under the guidance of the gas safety installation and use regulations, there is no legal requirement to disconnect an at risk installation or appliance'

and:

'The customer's permission must be sought to either rectify the appliance / installation or turn the appliance OFF'

However a common sense caveat is also included at the end:

'Gas installers must always err on the side of safety'

 

[BOB..DOLE]

Looks like oilsi could be right after all i have spent all morning looking this one up and it says turn off appliance ( but does not say how) so could be by gas or electric or in the case of the gas fire seems to say just turn off.

 

[ChrisR]

Yep, have only ever heard oilski's version.

Confirmed this week as it happens:
Called corgi to check when/if undersized vents (half proper size) were AR.
Compartment, vents to outside, 580/290cm sq = bl dy big holes in the door.
They confirmed AR (since August). Yes I had to ask permission, but the knob on the boiler would be OK to turn it off.

Difficult situation, being a rented property.
Didn't have time/vent/inclination to fix it there an then, so was faced with having to leave the tenant cold. Can't expect the tenant to keep using a boiler you've told him should be turned off. Landlord would go ape, Tenant would go to hotel...

What would you rgi's have done??

 

[corgiman]

in my comfy chair at home with a foaming pot of ale at my right hand I would be sanctimoniuos and say cut em off, but there and then with a successful spillage etc i probably would just have turned of the gas supply, like i have been taught since jesus was apprencticing for his dad


sheesh AR seems to me to be just a bit fancier than an NTC what is the point

 

[pannierstan]

That's the whole point though at risk is something which MAY lead to a situation which MAY become a risk to life or property, you cannot stop a customer using that appliance if they want to, merely arm them with the information to make a decision.I can quote from viper:

'Under the guidance of the gas safety installation and use regulations, there is no legal requirement to disconnect an at risk installation or appliance'

and:

'The customer's permission must be sought to either rectify the appliance / installation or turn the appliance OFF'

However a common sense caveat is also included at the end:

'Gas installers must always err on the side of safety'

This is exactly what I mean. We will argue about it till the cows come home and I like all fo you are aware that the book does not specify how to turn off.
Sorry if I made it sound otherwise.
I am just doing what I have always done, but I have to agree if its passing all the other checks O.K and I was on the spot it might be the power switch

Stan

 

[pannierstan]

sheesh AR seems to me to be just a bit fancier than an NTC what is the point

What Negative Temperature Co-efficient, surely not

Stan

 

[corgiman]

sheesh AR seems to me to be just a bit fancier than an NTC what is the point

What Negative Temperature Co-efficient, surely not

Stan

balls to it I meant NCS

Dammit it this has been a looong month