grade 2 can of worms

[trowelmonkey1]

Hi chaps,

Have a sniff of a job for a good customer of mine, he has a grade 2 cottage, exterior is panels of render in between timbers, he has muttered about having it rendered to cover the timber!

wanted to be forewarned for when the question is asked, i know he shouldn't be altering the exterior like this on a grade 2 without permission but that hasn't stopped him knocking the inside around and putting stud and board everywhere.

was hoping for some insights in 2 respects: ethics of doing this & techniques for rendering over this substrate assuming the ethics aren't too much of a stumbling block.

thanks guys

 

[1john]

whatever you do make sure it's removable, and easily. Ethically it is wrong, bill payingly, you may have to do the work.

This is a bad situation, does your good customer have any clue about what he is doing to this property and that it is illegal and he could be make to remove anything he does, and that he would have to restore the exterior in original materials? Or is he doing the old, see if I can get away with it and argue later with authorities ?

Personally, I would not do work like this, even if i could.

 

[JohnD]

in terms of paying your bills, will your trade be affected if you are branded a cowboy in the local press?

 

[joe-90]

Never work with children, animals or idiots - and he is comfortably amongst he latter.

 

[trowelmonkey1]

he's got a few quid and seems to do exactly what he likes so think he's just hoping no one will ever find out and if they do he'll argue the toss, think he's done similar before to the property when he moved in years ago.

difficult one this, he's fully aware, he runs an interiors company and has been for many years so he knows exactly what he's up to, he's been a very good source of work this year and a very good payer, lets me do work and just bill him for the time and materials, never asks for quoted, trusts me implicitly, but i suspect he's going to pitch this one to me over the next few weeks and don't know how to play it.

 

[Richard C]

does your good customer have any clue about what he is doing to this property and that it is illegal and he could be make to remove anything he does, and that he would have to restore the exterior in original materials? Or is he doing the old, see if I can get away with it and argue later with authorities ?

Personally, I would not do work like this, even if i could.

Doesn’t sound like a particularly good customer to me; apart from the grade 2 bit, does he realise that by covering the timbers, he’s condemning them all to rot in a relatively short space of time & that really will be expensive to rectify; personally, I’d walk away.

 

[marshman]

Talk him out of it if you can,
if not then I would batten it horizontal with 2x1 tile batten, no more than 400 centres then cover with a breathable roof membrane,
then use rib lath for your render key. screw the batten to the house timbers as it will help when you come to take it all off.

 

[external]

do it an take the cash ,aint your fault he dont now his arse from his earhole,your just paid labour its his gaff and its up to him how its done!
now go an make a few quid.

 

[joe-90]

do it an take the cash ,aint your fault he dont now his a**e from his earhole,your just paid labour its his gaff and its up to him how its done!
now go an make a few quid.

Why damage our heritage for the sakes of a few quid?

 

[1john]

I expect that explaining to him properly that the timbers WILL rot will be enough to keep you sweet with him to do other work and stop you having to decline the job on morals. In effect ereryone wins, who knows he may want to spend the money he saved doing this on having other things done, perhaps you could suggest painting the house to tidy it up and if you need the cash then offer to paint the house for him? Just a thought.

 

[trowelmonkey1]

all very good points chaps thanks!

marsh, i'll keep that technique in my memory bank for future use, like that!

Rich, think that should be enough to dissuade him will give him that one as soon as he mentions it.

cheers for the objectivity John1.

and thanks all, as always!

 

[thatbloke]

traditionally , and the right way to do this would be to put vertical laths on each stud (beam) then horizontally lath the entire outside of the building.
then , depending on what part of the country the building is in , you render in a lime render. this render usually is sharp sand , lime putty and cows hair however here in suffolk for instance medieval lime render was made up from chalk , cows hair and lime putty.
personally i wouldn't do this job out of principal , that house has stood there from way before its owner was born and hopefully will still be there long after he is gone , unless he destroys it first.
if you have to do it explain to him that it needs to be done properly.

timber framed houses move , they expand in winter and contract in the summer. this movement will crack a cement render and water will soak in , this moisture will have no where else to go and will rot the timbers and the brick plinth they rest on.

using lime will prevent this as lime , as i am sure you are aware of will expand and contract with the timber frame , the horse hair (usually goats hair these days) will keep it all together and lime , unlike cement will let water vapour through as it is porous thus alowing the building to 'breath'.

you could try giving these boys a call,
http://www.buildingconservation.com/directory/3j102b.htm

they will be able to tell you all you need to know. if this guy has plenty of money then he wont mind spending a few quid to have it done properly , but if not then if i were you i would be in the 'if you dont do it properly , dont do it at all' bag.