There is no such thing as "two tier policing"

[Mrs Ten Names]

Rioting needs to establish the link to a common purpose with at least 12 people. I know the judge is hinting that he thinks its there, but Its not for a Judge to decide.

So who decides it's a riot?

 

[motorbiking]

The rioters

 

[denso13]

There is talk of using a different charge. Rioting - max sentence 10 years.

It's a reflection a how serious the situation is and why they are trying to nip it in the bud. Sir Keir's experience in this has definitely helped along with the fast track convictions.

 

[Brigadier]

But I suspect most of them would sit quietly and drink

Definitely, as the trolls would have been laughed out of the pub long before

 

[motorbiking]

It's a reflection a how serious the situation is and why they are trying to nip it in the bud. Sir Keir's experience in this has definitely helped along with the fast track convictions.

While there is nothing new about fast tracking guilty pleas, there is a real risk of a miscarriage of justice.

 

[Mrs Ten Names]

The rioters

The prosecution bring the charges and the court decides if they're warranted.

 

[motorbiking]

The question was

So who decides it's a riot?

the definition of a riot is defined in law, sec 1 Public Order Act. you should know this, it was discussed quite recently.

If 12 or more persons who are present together use or threaten unlawful violence for a common purpose and the conduct of them (taken together) is such as would cause a person of reasonable firmness present at the scene to fear for his personal safety, each of the persons using unlawful violence for the common purpose is guilty of riot.

Hence it is the rioters that decide to riot. if you don't want to be done for rioting make sure there are less than a dozen of you.

 

[Mrs Ten Names]

the definition of a riot is defined in law, sec 1 Public Order Act.

Yet many have participated in the violence without being charged with riot. They've been charged with lesser offences.
If the definition was sufficient, they would all be charged with rioting.

 

[Brigadier]

Yet many have participated in the violence without being charged with riot. They've been charged with lesser offences.
If the definition was sufficient, they would all be charged with rioting.

Apart from the fact that you are incorrect, I fail to see what you're trying to prove anyway.

Why are you so exorcised by the fact that many have not been charged with "riot"?

 

[motorbiking]

I suggest Himmy read it again and pays attention to the bit where it says who are present together use or threaten unlawful violence for a common purpose and the conduct of them (taken together).

Its therefore easier to do them for violent disorder, particularly since most are willing (perhaps wrongly) to plead guilty to that offence.

 

[IT Minion]

Most of the people I've seen pleading guilty are repeat offenders. 70% had previous violent convictions at one stage according to the Met. They've been through the system before, some of them literally dozens of times.

Isn't the magistrates court pleading always next day after they are charged?

 

[Mrs Ten Names]

Apart from the fact that you are incorrect, I fail to see what you're trying to prove anyway.

If they have only been charged with violent disorder, yet the Act supposedly automatically assigns the description of riot to anything that meets the criteria. Then why were they not charged with rioting?
More than three persons = violent disorder.
More than twelve person = riot.

Surely, if the criteria is met, then the charges applied are automatic.

Why are you so exorcised by the fact that many have not been charged with "riot"?

Please don't try to assume why you think I make a comment.

 

[Brigadier]

Then why were they not charged with rioting?

Ask the CPS, mehbee?

Please don't try to assume why you think I make a comment.

You clearly are somewhat exorcised / intrigued / bothered by the fact: if you had no feelings either way about the fact, you wouldn't be posting about it.

And the fact that you are repeatedly posting about it, led me to my - not unreasonable - conclusion

 

[motorbiking]

not to mention failure to properly understand the definition of a riot.

 

[motorbiking]

Most of the people I've seen pleading guilty are repeat offenders. 70% had previous violent convictions at one stage according to the Met. They've been through the system before, some of them literally dozens of times.

Isn't the magistrates court pleading always next day after they are charged?

They can charge and Bail you, but if they want you remanded in custody then you are put before the magistrate.

You can then argue against remand if you want. if you plead guilty then the crown court simply deal with the sentencing.