A few questions for a knowledgable electrician

[riveralt]

In case you’re interested (probably not ), the discussion arose whilst I was dining with a close family member and a number of other barristers, one of whom was a QC with particular interest/expertise in this area. The debate was largely academic (and hence way over my head), but it was clear that the group included people who would probably have been prepared to present both arguments to a court, particularly since none of them was aware of the point having yet been tested in a court.
Kind Regards, John.

Barristers, might live on this planet but they often operate in another world. Your group are clearly not clued up on what was happening in relation to this particular statutory instrument.
Unless they were keeping their powder dry and licking their lips in anticipation of the fat fees to come.
It has certainly been widely discussed in legal circles for over 18 months with various warnings to firms - highlighting the importance of them not becoming a stated case.
It has been highlighted by the Law Society in March 2010.
http://www.lawsociety.org.uk/productsandservices/practicenotes/cancellingcontracts/4466.article
And some stated cases, albeit in relation to the credit agreement part of the statutory instrument are highlighted here.
http://www.piblawg.co.uk/post/2011/03/24/Credit-Hire-The-Never-Ending-Story.aspx
The bottom line.... for any work over £35 you must include all the elements required in the SI otherwise your client could refuse to pay and you could end up with a criminal conviction.
Whether or not electricians choose to ignore the legislation is up to them, I just don't want my name appearing after R v .....

Here is a recent case..
http://www.rhondda-cynon-taf.gov.uk/en/news/archive/2011/june/roguetraderprosecuted.aspx

 

[sparkticus]

with various warnings to firms - highlighting the importance of them not becoming a stated case.

I gave up reading them in the end. One went on to remind me of the risks of not keeping van tyres in good condition

But, I always provide a contract and it has always included cancellation rights and deposit refund information. Usually my contracts are very much in the favour of the client though I am happy to say that we have never had to test a contract in any way because we tend to give way to reasonable changes/demands. there have been a few occasions where I have felt that we have been taken advantage of but rather than risk a bad reputation (people never convey disputed contract issues accurately and its usually the service provider who looks bad) I usually just do any reasonable xtra work/take care of "extended warranty" issues and move on.

 

[JohnW2]

This seems to be seriously drifting off-topic, but .....

Barristers, might live on this planet but they often operate in another world.

There are certainly times when I may feel that about my daughter, although she probably wouldn't thank me for saying so

It has been highlighted by the Law Society in March 2010.
http://www.lawsociety.org.uk/productsandservices/practicenotes/cancellingcontracts/4466.article

At a quick look through, plus a bit of scanning, that merely seems to be a commentary, with examples, on the SI, with no specific mention of the verbal contracts issue.

And some stated cases, albeit in relation to the credit agreement part of the statutory instrument are highlighted here.
http://www.piblawg.co.uk/post/2011/03/24/Credit-Hire-The-Never-Ending-Story.aspx

It does seem from this that barristers are not the only ones with varying opinions:

• However judges in the county courts are reaching inconsistent decisions on the question of whether the 2008 Regulations have been complied with. Take for instance the decision by HHJ Vosper QC in Guerro v Nykoo (2010) Swansea CC. .....In Orley v Viewpoint Housing Association Ltd (2010) Gateshead CC, HHJ Armstrong reached a different conclusion on more or less identical facts. Both judgments, at least at first blush, appear to be fully reasoned.

Here is a recent case..
http://www.rhondda-cynon-taf.gov.uk/en/news/archive/2011/june/roguetraderprosecuted.aspx[/QUOTE]
That could be a relevant case, but it is not totally clear that the contract was verbal nor, if it was, whether the defendent's lawyers argued that a verbal contract might not require a written notice; one therefore can't be sure whether the point we're discussing was tested by the court or not.

As I said before, I think this discussion is probably irrelevant to most electricians, who probably provide written contracts - since anyone who provides a written contract (in customer's home, and for more than £35) without the required cancellation notice is just plain daft!!

Kind Regards,John.