A few questions for a knowledgable electrician

[sparkticus]

Just one other point. If the electrician got the OP to accept the changes by stating "that's what the regs say" then he can't use customer acceptance of the changes as a get out. It sound very much like he's lied to the customer and you can't expect a non-qualified customer to know the details of all the regs.

True though this may one of those situations where there is not enough documented evidence either way. The myhammer site specifically tells the customer and supplier that they have entered into a binding agreement for what that is worth since the 10mm CSA SWA (or 4mm SWA) is apparently not documented.

I suspect the best the OP can hope for is

- Reasonable response from the electrician with some partial refund. I can not imagine the electrician replacing the cable unless under orders to so so (I may be wrong but seems a stretch)

- Some sense in the back of the electricians mind that he needs to avoid such problems in the future by being honest with customers - do they ever learn though? probably not.

 

[sparkticus]

As a NAPIT member

So you are the one NAPIT member

Yep my £400 yearly subscription is going to be stretched on this one

Actually, all joking aside, I generally hear good things about NAPIT. I know several NIC migrants who saw the light

 

[FunkyJive]

...If the electrician got the OP to accept the changes by stating "that's what the regs say" then he can't use customer acceptance of the changes as a get out.

Yes, it begs the question as to why I would post a clear specification, stating (along with all relevant details) cable size and minimum current, having the price accepted by the engineer via the MyHammer website (same job, same page), and then I wind up with a sub-grade installation and (as an electronics engineer, aware of the 16A limit and CU trip) for the same price.

Clearly a case to answer, and yet further valuable information to refer to. I'd buy all you guys a beer if geography wasn't a barrier, so hopefully a simple "Thank you" will suffice on this occasion

Wish me luck, and thank you all.

FJ

 

[sparkticus]

Clearly a case to answer, and yet further valuable information to refer to. I'd buy all you guys a beer if geography wasn't a barrier, so hopefully a simple "Thank you" will suffice on this occasion

Wish me luck, and thank you all.

Yes good luck with it and certainly do not let it drop, as has been said these people let the rest down so they need to feel a little pain. Whatever is documented on the myhammer site will certainly help.

PS,

Don't don't let a few hundred miles stop you from buying a round

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

I'll have a Guinness next time I am in Newmarket.

 

[martinxxxxxx]

I suspect the best the OP can hope for is

- Reasonable response from the electrician with some partial refund. I can not imagine the electrician replacing the cable unless under orders to so so (I may be wrong but seems a stretch)

The worse he can hope for is that the install shall be made good or he will get a full refund, under the right to cancel regulations. If the electrician check with NAPIT or Trading standards he will realise that if does not play ball criminal charges and a fine await him should he fail to sort out this con.

Unlike the tarmac cowboys that this legislation was brought in to protect the pulic against, an electrician has to leave a trail of paperwork that basically prove the case against him

 

[sparkticus]

I suspect the best the OP can hope for is

- Reasonable response from the electrician with some partial refund. I can not imagine the electrician replacing the cable unless under orders to so so (I may be wrong but seems a stretch)

The worse he can hope for is that the install shall be made good or he will get a full refund, under the right to cancel regulations. If the electrician check with NAPIT or Trading standards he will realise that if does not play ball criminal charges and a fine await him should he fail to sort out this con.

Unlike the tarmac cowboys that this legislation was brought in to protect the pulic against, an electrician has to leave a trail of paperwork that basically prove the case against him

Yes I had no doubt of that with any departures from BS7671/compliance issues (I have the same constraints with the NICEIC) but this is a contractual issue and surely that will require at least some remnants of a contract? Maybe whatever is written on the myhammer site will suffice?

 

[sparkticus]

Aha, sorry. I missed this posted by riveralt

QUOTE

Cancellation Rights
31.For all work over the value of £35.00 completed in the
domestic market, members must provide the
householder with a seven working day ‘cooling off
period’ form, as required by The Cancellation of
Contracts made in a Consumer's home or place of
work etc Regulations (2008). The cooling off period
form must provide details of how the contract can be
cancelled, together with name and address of the
person to contact.

UNQUOTE

That certainly suggests that said electrician could be in trouble!!

 

[FunkyJive]

...
That certainly suggests that said electrician could be in trouble!!

Yes, I guess that £1200 adequately qualifies


Best,
FJ

 

[sparkticus]

...
That certainly suggests that said electrician could be in trouble!!

Yes, I guess that £1200 adequately qualifies

That settles it at that price I am moving to Cambridge!! I assume he did more work than you have listed?

EDIT, I see he replaced the CU also but even then he certainly made a profit!

 

[FunkyJive]

A certain "Cambridge Factor" certainly appears to apply to most jobs here

My partner's retired parents were charged £850 for replacing a consumer unit relocated the other side of a wall.

Could it be mere coincidence that the acronym for "Rip-Off Britain" also spells "ROB"

The cost of living here is enough, so I doubt moving to Cambridge would make you much better off


All the best,
FJ

 

[FunkyJive]

I'll have a Guinness next time I am in Newmarket.

I could've guessed your pleasure


All the best,
FJ

 

[martinxxxxxx]

... but this is a contractual issue and surely that will require at least some remnants of a contract? Maybe whatever is written on the myhammer site will suffice?

It will be for the electrician to demonstrate that he complied with the law,to do this he will have to shaow a written and sign contract stating the "Right to cancel" wording

It amazes me that not one consumer that I have ever got to sign this has EVER seen one before. They always read it VERY closely to make sure that they are not signing there home over to me , To think it is for their protection too. I often wonder if I am the only one complying with this. And I know of tradesman that have had to give away a boiler because the customer complained and it turn out that he did not get a waiver signed. He was LUCKY not to be prosecuted.

 

[sparkticus]

... but this is a contractual issue and surely that will require at least some remnants of a contract? Maybe whatever is written on the myhammer site will suffice?

It will be for the electrician to demonstrate that he complied with the law,to do this he will have to shaow a written and sign contract stating the "Right to cancel" wording

It amazes me that not one consumer that I have ever got to sign this has EVER seen one before. They always read it VERY closely to make sure that they are not signing there home over to me , To think it is for their protection too. I often wonder if I am the only one complying with this. And I know of tradesman that have had to give away a boiler because the customer complained and it turn out that he did not get a waiver signed. He was LUCKY not to be prosecuted.

This is interesting, most of my commercial/industrial customers supply me with a contract and from time to time I write them. I never do any work without some form of contract which to be fair I always write in the customers favour. For domestic my son handles most of that (we are dual registered: approved contractor and domestic installer) my son is the qualified supervisor for the DI scheme. Again, I usually write the contracts which form part of the quote and is always in the customers favour. There have been several occasions where we have replaced failed sockets, failed RCDS and a few other items free of charge outside of any warranty period we may have offered. The cost of such items is minimal and for the few minutes it takes to fit these items it is not worth risking reputation over. Having said that there have been two/three occasions where I felt I was being short changed by the customer but I try to look beyond that because debating it always leads to a no win situation anyway. For domestic we also provide the six years insurance backed warranty scheme but that covers compliance issues only not contractual issues.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Cancellation Rights
31.For all work over the value of £35.00 completed in the
domestic market, members must provide the
householder with a seven working day ‘cooling off
period’ form, as required by The Cancellation of
Contracts made in a Consumer's home or place of
work etc Regulations (2008). The cooling off period
form must provide details of how the contract can be
cancelled, together with name and address of the
person to contact.

I may have missed a bit - but surely this only applies to the customer changing his mind before the work has started.

He can't cancel it after completion.