BALANCING PROBLEMS

[sukilou]

hi all
i would appreciate any help you can give

where to start
we live in a three story townhouse
our boiler and central heating system is over 30 years old
the boiler works (we get hot water)
the pump works (new)

the heating only comes on if the hot water is on aswell
we have tried again and again to balance our system.

the kitchen (1st floor)is the first radiator to heat up. gets very hot when wide open if you try to close it by a mm. it just gives up and goes cold.
try opening it again it won't work unless you turn the heating on and off 3 times

the bathroom(1st floor) radiator second to heat up. the right hand side pipe heats first, but the left hand pipe gets hotter five mins later

the living room( 1st floor) is a 10ft rad and only warms if you turn all other rads off.

there are lots of other probs aswell but lets take one thing at a time.
i have coped with 1 rad on all winter and just can't bear getting to next winter

please please help
is it that we just have the house that jack built

 

[Softus]

Heating circulation problems are often caused by the sludge that results from a corroding system.

Unless you happen to know that it's been well-maintained and that a chemical inhibitor has been added, then it's best to start by assessing the internal state of the system.

Do you get what seems to be air accumulating in radiators, that requires frequent venting?

If you run water out of the rad vents, it is clear or dirty, possibly even black?

Can you force water through rads that tend to be cold by shutting off the rads that tend to be hot?

What's the state of the water in the F&E cistern in the loft? Is there sludge at the bottom of the cistern?

Did you see inside the pump that was removed?

 

[sukilou]

well maintained-chemical inhibitor added by us- flushed system

no air accumulating tiny amount when bled

can force water through all rads- but won't stay on together

cistern is clean

pump was all ok when removed only replaced because we had a flood in the room it was house and it is very low to the floor and it got drowned

 

[Softus]

All sounds good.

What boiler do you have?

What programmer do you have?

What motorised valves do you have?

What bypass circuit do you have?

 

[sukilou]

back in 5 mins with answers

 

[sukilou]

boiler - IDEAL E type CF model no. 60N BGC41 409 14

programmer - potterton EP 3000

motorised valve - none to my knowledge

bypass circuit - none to my knowledge

 

[Softus]

OK. It could be that your system doesn't provide you with any means of controlling the heat used for the hot water.

Do you have a cylinder thermostat?

If so, is it adjusted correctly? A reasonable setting would be 60°C.

If not, do you find that your hot water comes out of the taps exceedingly hot?

 

[sukilou]

cylinder thermostat -?? think its an emersion heater

yes water is very hot

 

[Softus]

cylinder thermostat -?? think its an emersion heater

Er, no, that's not what I meant. With your system the immersion heater is a backup system, so should be turned off. A cylinder thermostat would be mounted on the side of the cylinder, about one-third of the way up.

I'm guessing that you might not have a room thermostat either. Even if you do, it sounds like the room temperature isn't high enough to turn off the central heating.

yes water is very hot

Hmm. And does the boiler tend to make kettling noises before turning itself off for a rest?

It sounds like you don't have enough control of the way that the heat from the boiler is distributed. The quickest and cheapest option for you is to fit a manual valve so that you throttle down the flow into the cylinder coil. You should, however, NOT allow this valve to be shut off entirely.

A manual valve, whilst cheap, is a bodge, and current conservation of energy regulations take this further with the requirement to fit thermostats and motorised valves that together shut off (a) the flow from the boiler and (b) the boiler when appropriate.

If initial information is anything to go by, you should look at renovating the system, perhaps further into the spring when you don't need the heating on as much.

In the long run this will save you money, make you more comfortable, and extend the life of the system.

 

[sukilou]

we had a feeling we had to gut the thing

the immersion isn't on no we haven't got a cylinder thermostat

we do have a room thermostat. but as you say no heat

err kettling noises no not really just the pilot burning up.

 

[sukilou]

thanks for all your help

we will look into a manual valve

 

[Softus]

we had a feeling we had to gut the thing

That's not what I'm suggesting.

Unless you suspect the pipework of being clogged, then all you need to do is design in some controls and then install them.

the immersion isn't on no we haven't got a cylinder thermostat

That's easily fixed. The main expense is going to be buying the motorised valves.

we do have a room thermostat. but as you say no heat

err kettling noises no not really just the pilot burning up.

Not sure what you mean by "the pilot burning up". Can you expand on this?

 

[sukilou]

the boiler doesn't make noises apart from when it turns on you can hear the flame of the pilot light burning

to be truthful i haven't got a clue what kettling sounds like but i don't think we have that problem