Fire door hinge

[chirpychippy]

May i ask for some help with ironmongery? In my workshop i have a steel fire door that is about to fall apart. i am going to replace it with a 1hr rated flush door. The steel door functioned in a way that it could be opened to 90 degrees then lock open, but would slam shut when pulled.

I have looked at sprung hinges and pergo closers but these would only serve to close the door, is there anything on the market that would work in the same as the ironmongery on the steel door that could be used on a flush door?

Thank you in advance

 

[gregers]

you can buy stays that have to be pulled to close,have them on my workshop doors at work.

 

[chirpychippy]

Thank you gregers, would you be able to provide me with a link to the aforementioned stays please

 

[gregers]

something like this,
http://compare.ebay.co.uk/like/1609...ixedPriceItemTypes&var=sbar&adtype=pla&crdt=0

you can also get this type of thing built into an overhead door closer.

 

[chirpychippy]

Thank you very much indeed gregers. May I ask another question, I have been trawling through the building regs for hours now and can't find an answer to this question. A Fire Door is fitted with some sort of closer, be it Pergo, overhead, or electronically operated. The door I am changing is means of escape and whilst the current one catches in the 90 degree position and remains open, once this catch is released it slams shut with extreme force, bl##dy dangerous.

So my question is this, do means of escape doors need self closing devices, it would seem odd that the door your using to get of the building wants to keep closing itself?

 

[^woody^]

In normal circumstances, you don't need a fire door or self closing device on a final exit door to outside

Final exit doors should open outwards and have an easily operable latch mechanism such as a panic bar or similar handle than only needs to be pushed or leant on to open the door

You can get the normal hydraulic closers with a hold open arm that you would then just push backwards from the held position to operate

A dictator device will stop any slamming

A self closing device should not allow the door to travel too fast when closing, else you would be liable if someone got injured

 

[gregers]

either you have a perko already fitted to the door or a knackered over head door closer?with perkos they arnt the best in the world for adjustment,whereas the over head can be adjusted right up/down accordingly.
i normally allow about 8 seconds from 90degrees to closed.
on overhead closers you can get back check models so they offer some resistance when they go past 90.
woody is correct about a dictator but i would say if your closer is working correctly then you dont need 1 of those.

 

[chirpychippy]

The outcome of the final exit door was that no self closing device nor any device to hold the door is required. The only requirement is a push bar additionally the doors dont have to be fire rated either, I think its worth adding that this door takes me outside of the building. Cheers

Once again confusion prevails, I have again looked at the regs for fire doors on the planning portal and drawn a blank with this one. Currently doing refurb in block of three flats "large 3 storey Victorian property converted to three self contained flats in the 70's". On the 2nd floor I have moved the kitchen units from the landing into a bedroom making it the kitchen in doing so I am required to put an FD30 door in place of the current standard door which leads into the corridor, does this door need I intumesent strips with smoke or not? And does it require a self closer and do I still need to upgrade the stops?

Additionally, on the escape route from flat into stairwell does this does need to beFD60 with smoke and is a pergo acceptable or should be an overhead closer.

I notice on the planning portal they mention FD20 doors do you what applications these are for?

Thank you.

 

[gregers]

no you dont need to upgrade the stops any more.
when i have fitted a large amount of fire doors in a student accommodation block (although a few years back)all service doors had strips fitted but when it came to the corridors or the bedrooms all doors had smoke seals fitted.
maybe worth giving your local council fire officer a ring to see what THAT council stipulate?
i seem to think that some kind of closure needs to be fitted whether its a perko or over head?

i know of some one who was doing quite a few of these upgrades in hastings area,and he was also putting instumiscent pads behind all butts and wrapping any locks aswell.

 

[chirpychippy]

Ok mate, thank you for your help, i always strikes me as strange that building regs are stipulating you must do this and then in the next breath you don't need to anymore. Is it just pen pusher trying to justify their salary starts to look like a farce after a while.

Cheers

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

Or maybe you don't understand the regulations.

 

[gregers]

its the blind leading the blind,i done a load of doors in a friends hotel and she was told she had to build an porch type arrangement into her residents lounge for fire proffing she ended up paying an expert to survey exactly what needed to be done in the eyes of the "law" and guess what it didnt need doing.
think its a bit like an mot test,different testers may or not pass or fail over different things.

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

Interpreting the Regs in existing buildings will always be left to the interpretation of the individual inspector or other consultant left to sign his name away. The regs offer a just one solution to achieving Building Regulations Approval and by their very nature they do not (and cannot) allow for the multitude of real life scenarios and layouts that exist in reality.