Will this work - power planer

[Deleted member 174758]

Almost always up early - can't get out of a habit from an entire working lifetime, I'm afraid. Drives the missus nuts

Yor decorator might also thank you for using wood - it is a lot easier for him/her to blend in seamlessly if you do a good job and use 2-pack filler. Filler alone on such a big area always seems to show

 

[^woody^]

Problem is that filler like that is always discernable becauze itvtends to shrink, crack, fall out or a combination of any/all of the above.

Two part or car body filler don't do either.

Also the trick is to not sand it dead smooth - a single final stroke with some 80 or 120 paper seems to help it blend in with grain.

I've seen timber pads show the edges from either shrinkage or not being cut perfectly, so if a DIYer has to ask about doing this I would suggest that he wont get so good results in trying to blend a timber pad in.

And in context, unless the frame will be left doorless, the repair will be largely obscured anyway.

 

[opps]

Ooooh, bodgy! also frowned on in fire door casings on the grounds that some fillers are flamable

I was aware that two pack (styrene) fillers are flammable before they cure but I cannot find any thing to confirm that they are "particularly" flammable after curing. I did however find articles suggesting that 2 part epoxy resins are actually fire retardant.

Do you have any links? I do not doubt you but I have never managed to (accidentally) ignite 2 pack styrene fillers when burning off paint but I guess I am only using a 650 degree C source when doing so.

Out of interest, when looking at fire doors, I guess the rating is based upon a given temperature. Do you know what that temperature is?

 

[Munroast]

Almost always up early - can't get out of a habit from an entire working lifetime, I'm afraid. Drives the missus nuts

Yor decorator might also thank you for using wood - it is a lot easier for him/her to blend in seamlessly if you do a good job and use 2-pack filler. Filler alone on such a big area always seems to show

I've went the opposite way, after a lifetime of early starts i'm now making up for it by not getting up - rarely out of my bed before 9 these days.

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Back to the original post, I would of probably made the rebates a little deeper so as the Dutchman could have been 5 to 8mm thick, I think I would get a better job that way and may be easier?

 

[^woody^]

I was aware that two pack (styrene) fillers are flammable before they cure but I cannot find any thing to confirm that they are "particularly" flammable after curing. I did however find articles suggesting that 2 part epoxy resins are actually fire retardant.

Do you have any links? I do not doubt you but I have never managed to (accidentally) ignite 2 pack styrene fillers when burning off paint but I guess I am only using a 650 degree C source when doing so.

Out of interest, when looking at fire doors, I guess the rating is based upon a given temperature. Do you know what that temperature is?

It's not really to do with flammability, as wood and the paint covering it is flammable, but its more to do with that a fire door or fire door set is only certified when installed in accordance with the way it was tested and approved. So strictly, any alterations for a fire door or the frame potentially render the certification invalid - filler or timber splices.

 

[^woody^]

I've went the opposite way, after a lifetime of early starts i'm now making up for it by not getting up - rarely out of my bed before 9 these days.

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Back to the original post, I would of probably made the rebates a little deeper so as the Dutchman could have been 5 to 8mm thick, I think I would get a better job that way and may be easier?

That could be a slippery slope

 

[Deleted member 174758]

I was aware that two pack (styrene) fillers are flammable before they cure but I cannot find any thing to confirm that they are "particularly" flammable after curing. I did however find articles suggesting that 2 part epoxy resins are actually fire retardant.
Out of interest, when looking at fire doors, I guess the rating is based upon a given temperature. Do you know what that temperature is?

@^woody^ beat me to the draw on that one! There are cases where you are allowed "bend" the rules (normally with express limitations set by the Fire Inspector or a similar person), e.g. feature door sets in listed buildings where the Heritage Officer has decreed that the doors must stay in and damage be repaired, but in those instances you are supposed to use similar materials to the materials originally used (i.e. matching timber) not filler which may burn at a different rate to the original structure and the door will normally be protected by several coats of intumescent lacquer or intumescent paint and other steps to minimise fire risk, such as sprinkler systems may additionally be installed. We are often allowed to make Dutchman repairs on fire door casings providing we use material matching the original spec. and the amount of filler is minimal, but every build is different

 

[Munroast]

That could be a slippery slope

what, getting up later and later or making the recess deeper?

 

[notenoughcash]

titebond, shims of the wood on the door you are using e.g. oak or whatever, and then sander or track saw

dont touch it with a planer

 

[Deleted member 174758]

titebond, shims of the wood on the door you are using e.g. oak or whatever, and then sander or track saw

I am trying to figure out how on earth you'd use a track saw on the jamb of a door casing (or on the edge of a door), and for that matter how a belt sander would do the job without risking wrecking a door casing.

 

[notenoughcash]

RAS or a track saw,with clamps, but not in the t-slots

 

[Deleted member 174758]

But why throw hundreds of pounds of equipment at a minor problem (which, incidentally will not work) when a £20 block or hand plane will do the job?

A Dutchman in the edge of a door looks like this:

By its' nature you cannot make them dead to size and guaranteed getting a dead fit, sio we make them slightly oversize (a couple of millimetres) then trim them in. But how do you deal with the little lip which will be left projecting from the face when the main projection has been removed?

If the door is veneer-faced or is a hollow door you just can't run a belt sander on it as it risks going through the surface veneer, soime of which are well under a millimetre thick. Run a random orbit sander on it alone and you'll probably dub over (round off) the edge of the door (and you'll stil risk going through the veneer) whilst a saw with a rail (track) cannot be clamped onto an edge that narrow. Best solution is a cheap block plane and a bit of hand sanding

But there are far more Dutchmen applied to door casings, in the rebates, than doors, because often a door is being replaced whilst the casing is not. In that instance you can't even get a rail saw in to do the main flush cut because therere is no guarantee that the architrave you need to sit the rail on is level, most of the time the architrave isn't wide enough to support the rail (you need about 100 to 120mm to support a guide rail - architraves are often just 50 to 70mm wide) and there is no easy way to secure the rail in place, vertically on the architrave - and that's before you hit the issue that a guide rail is 5mm thick, the architrave is 18mm thick and the hinge leaf is 35 to 38mm or so deep = 61mm whilst most track saws have a maximum depth of 55mm. So your saw can't make a deep enough cut

Again, this is a task for a humble block plane.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all in favour of power tools for a lot of tasks (without them I wouldn't earn a living), and the plunging rail/track saw is one of the better tools to have come to the fore in the last 2 decades (I wouldn't be without mine). It's just that this isn't a task which can be accomplished with one. Sometimes simpler is better

 

[bsr]

Interesting there is such debate. I made mine 1mm undersized in width and lined up the edge of the Dutchman with the corner of the casing. So nothing to trim on that edge. The other side was just a dab of wood filler.

Tbh the corner was the whole reason for me using Dutchmen. I find it takes ages for me to get really neat corners otherwise.

 

[Deleted member 174758]

I normally find myself doing two or three at a time on the same door casing, often on multiple door casings on a job. The hinge recesses aren't always good. Many are horrendous after "handymen" or janitors have "maintained" them over the years, so it is often necessary to square them out and flush the bottoms to make them neat enough to glue to (which needs a smooth flat surface). The edges of the timber frame are not always discernable due to paint build-up, so if you have a nice sharp block plane and have made your dutchmen slightly proud it takes but a couple of minutes to plane each one in and smooth it to the surface, even if that involves removing a bit of paint. Work into a corner can be undertaken with a bullnose plane or even a wide chisel and a sanding board. Using loads of filler is not the ideal way to go as you can almost always see it, it can crack too easily and it invariably sinks