I thought that we were all equal?

[ellal]

So, in your simple logic, would you let anyone in to OUR country?

My country too, but then I'm not the 'simple one' here

(I wonder if you can be found at one of those extremist marches that various nutjobs hold every now and again to proclaim 'britishness' whilst dragging their knuckles on the ground and smashing bits of 'their' country up

)



But aws to the question then I guess it depends on whether you think it is only us that can improve our standard of living...

A member of our family is studying in Europe for free instead of being burdoned for life by our education system...

As a result their life chances have improved greatly...

So it would be hypocritical of me to say others shouldn't be able to do the same...

My 'simple logic' is because although local language skills were not required (courses mainly in English), we insisted on funding the learning of that local language beforehand in order to 'fit in'...

In other words being comfortable with the 'local' language!

English is a victim of it's own success, because in addition to all the invading we have done, English has taken over the internet to a certain extent and music/film influences are almost everywhere...



So how about you tell us who you would let in or not...

Bearing in mind the huge number of ex-pats who 'improved their lot' that may be affected by your answer

 

[ellal]

in other words this country is becoming less and less attractive and immigration will tailor off and migration to other better economies doing better around the word will happen within the next 10 or so years

Quite right

And that migration will include millions of 'British people' as has been the case throughout history!

Of course those having 'hissy fits' over immigration can't see beyond the ragtop headlines and 'the bloke in the pub', let alone look at the history of economic rises and falls and their associated population effects

I wonder if any of those types benefitted from, or knew someone who benefitted from the migration of British workers to Europe in the 80's?

I'm too old now but, if I were younger and looking for somewhere else to live, I think I could do much worse than choose Australia.

Here's one who fits the 'hypocrite' bill!

 

[JBR]

I know you haven't asked for my opinion on the matter, Ella, but being a kindly soul I'll give it to you anyway.

I agree with Nigel Farage's stated opinion: that we should welcome anyone wishing to immigrate into this country just so long as they are of some benefit to us.

I believe that Australia and the United States, among others, hold the same opinion.

And, before you ask, I believe that this works both ways: I would expect other countries to maintain the same limitations. I worked in Saudi Arabia for a few years. They would not have allowed me in if I hadn't been of some use to them.

 

[ellal]

I know you haven't asked for my opinion on the matter, Ella, but being a kindly soul I'll give it to you anyway.

I agree with Nigel Farage's stated opinion: that we should welcome anyone wishing to immigrate into this country just so long as they are of some benefit to us.

I believe that Australia and the United States, among others, hold the same opinion.

And, before you ask, I believe that this works both ways: I would expect other countries to maintain the same limitations. I worked in Saudi Arabia for a few years. They would not have allowed me in if I hadn't been of some use to them.

A fair and honest reply for once which is welcome...

But one which begs the following questions...

What is the definition of being of 'some benefit to us'?

And who decides?

Because in my travels around the world I have done many 'menial' jobs that the locals could have done simply to support myself...

But the multitude of experiences meant that I have been able to improve my life chances immeasurably, and then be able to pass on to the next generation the same idea of 'chances'... (see my earlier post)

But if you believe in it 'working both ways', then maybe you can also answer this...

What 'benefits' are the ex-pats who have retired overseas contributing to those countries when they are now (in their hundreds of thousands) relying on local benefits and local healthcare?

And as you believe in it 'working both ways', could you tell us what you think should happen to ex-pats reliant on state aid in other countries should your (so far arbitrary) 'benefit to us' criteria be applied?

 

[JBR]

I am not party to the country's specific needs, but I suspect that there will be some who are.

Basically, if the country needs people possessing certain skills or abilities, they should be welcomed. For example: if we are short of doctors, invite doctors; if we are short of lawyers (God forbid), invite lawyers. Needless to say, they should be qualified to our existing standards.

I suspect we are not too short of buskers, beggars, prostitutes and so on.

As for British expats, many are retirees who move to Spain for a nicer climate. Their pension is paid from this country and yet they spend their money, and thus contribute to the economy, in Spain.

Were I ever to emigrate to Australia, as I threatened earlier, I'd be in exactly the same situation.

 

[ellal]

I am not party to the country's specific needs, but I suspect that there will be some who are.

But you argue that it should be down to 'what the country needs', so surely you must have an idea of who should decide?

Or was that just a soundbite rather than an actual solution?

You'd make a wonderful politician

I on the other hand would not, because I believe in what I say and think my argument through!

In addition the world is ruled by 'vested interests' not by what people actually need...

So the people who would actually decide are those who are telling our politicians what to do right now

 

[ellal]

As for British expats, many are retirees who move to Spain for a nicer climate. Their pension is paid from this country and yet they spend their money, and thus contribute to the economy, in Spain.

Were I ever to emigrate to Australia, as I threatened earlier, I'd be in exactly the same situation.

Were you ever to emigrate to Australia may I suggest you research beforehand...

In the EU your pension would be uprated as here each year, but if you move to one of more than 100 countries (including Canada, Australia, New Zealand and South Africa) your state pension will be permanently frozen at the date you retire or on arrival there.

(Luckily for you Israel isn't one of those countries )

 

[pred]

As for British expats, many are retirees who move to Spain for a nicer climate. Their pension is paid from this country and yet they spend their money, and thus contribute to the economy, in Spain.

Were I ever to emigrate to Australia, as I threatened earlier, I'd be in exactly the same situation.

Were you ever to emigrate to Australia may I suggest you research beforehand...

In the EU your pension would be uprated as here each year, but if you move to one of more than 100 countries (including Canada, Australia, New Zealand and South Africa) your state pension will be permanently frozen at the date you retire or on arrival there.

(Luckily for you Israel isn't one of those countries )

Do I detect a stab at sarcasm?? The lowest form of wit! Although it can be the funniest!!

 

[JBR]

I am not party to the country's specific needs, but I suspect that there will be some who are.

But you argue that it should be down to 'what the country needs', so surely you must have an idea of who should decide?

Businessmen? Alan Sugar?

You'd make a wonderful politician

I'm afraid not. I find it very difficult to lie and keep a straight face.

I on the other hand would not, because I believe in what I say and think my argument through!

That's because you are perfect.

 

[pred]

I am not party to the country's specific needs, but I suspect that there will be some who are.

But you argue that it should be down to 'what the country needs', so surely you must have an idea of who should decide?

Businessmen? Alan Sugar?

You'd make a wonderful politician

I'm afraid not. I find it very difficult to lie and keep a straight face.

I on the other hand would not, because I believe in what I say and think my argument through!

That's because you are perfect.

A perfect????

 

[ellal]

Businessmen? Alan Sugar?

Now you're taking the p*ss

That's like making Richard Branson head of El Al

That's because you are perfect.

Not perfect - just realistic!

 

[JBR]

Businessmen? Alan Sugar?

Now you're taking the p*ss

That's like making Richard Branson head of El Al

So who would you ask to decide? The Council of Mosques?

 

[jockscott]

Now you're taking the p*ss

That's like making Richard Branson head of El Al

Sadly you've forgotten that Sir Richard Branson was the head of a successful airline. (perhaps you meant NASA ?? )

 

[big-all]

As for British expats, many are retirees who move to Spain for a nicer climate. Their pension is paid from this country and yet they spend their money, and thus contribute to the economy, in Spain.

Were I ever to emigrate to Australia, as I threatened earlier, I'd be in exactly the same situation.

Were you ever to emigrate to Australia may I suggest you research beforehand...

In the EU your pension would be uprated as here each year, but if you move to one of more than 100 countries (including Canada, Australia, New Zealand and South Africa) your state pension will be permanently frozen at the date you retire or on arrival there.

(Luckily for you Israel isn't one of those countries )

unless its changed very recently your pension stays at the same level when you leave uk shore for the eu
thats why many expats will come back to the uk every few years for 6 months plus to uprate there pension as a uk citizen again

 

[JBR]

Thanks BA. That's useful to know.