Illegal cabling(?) and strange box

[Simon35]

The cut-out and everything prior are usually owned by and the responsibility of the DNO. Any issues should be sorted by the DNO at no cost.

I had an old main switch leaking tar or pitch upfront of my meter/cutout up until last year, replaced by the DNO at no cost to me.

Anyhow, good for you to get it sorted and tidied up.

 

[JBR]

Thanks Simon. I'll bear that in mind when they give me the good/bad news. I'll also be sure to let them know I'm a poor pensioner!

 

[Spark123]

The fabric covered cables look like VIR to me, they are rubber insulated with a wax coated fabric on the exterior. Don't touch them!

 

[ban-all-sheds]

So, if this is the old cutout, at the point of entry,

Untitled

• JBR
• 30 Mar 2015
• 1

how did this one come to get installed as well?

Untitled

• JBR
• 30 Mar 2015
• 1

It can't have been done by a dodgy electrician.

we moved in about ten years ago and we had an inspection done (can't remember details now). Following that, the gentleman who did the remedial wiring and CU installation was NICEIC (I think) registered, although I'm now a little doubtful about his work.

Indeed.

I wonder what results he got when testing things involving earth....

 

[JBR]

The fabric covered cables look like VIR to me, they are rubber insulated with a wax coated fabric on the exterior. Don't touch them!

I won't! If they are fabric-covered rubber, won't they need replacing?

 

[JBR]

So, if this is the old cutout, at the point of entry,

Untitled

• JBR
• 30 Mar 2015
• 1

how did this one come to get installed as well?

Untitled

• JBR
• 30 Mar 2015
• 1

It can't have been done by a dodgy electrician.

You tell me! My first thought, on discovering the old metal box, was that it must have been a redundant installation - until I discovered it was still live. I had assumed that the cables that come out of the conduit near the CU came directly from outside. As the old box was hidden away under a fitted wardrobe, I can well understand that no-one else knew about it either.

When I spoke to the DNO gentleman, however, he confirmed that according to their maps/plans that is exactly where the mains enters the house.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

If they are fabric-covered rubber, won't they need replacing?

Yes.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

You tell me! My first thought, on discovering the old metal box, was that it must have been a redundant installation - until I discovered it was still live. I had assumed that the cables that come out of the conduit near the CU came directly from outside. As the old box was hidden away under a fitted wardrobe, I can well understand that no-one else knew about it either.

When I spoke to the DNO gentleman, however, he confirmed that according to their maps/plans that is exactly where the mains enters the house.

Could well be that the new cutout by the meter wasn't the first one at that location - on reflection that wooden board looks like it's been there for more than 10 years.

But at some point in the past a DNO employee must have put the first one there.

We may find out later today if at the time the normal procedure would/could have been to replace fuse(s) in the old cutout with solid link(s) and leave it in situ.

 

[Taylortwocities]

Indeed.

I wonder what results he got when testing things involving earth....

Yes, his Ze figure should be interesting……..

But at some point in the past a DNO employee must have put the first one there.

Judging by the age of it, the original supply may well have been provided by the Mid-Cheshire Electricity Supply Company, or something...

 

[Guitarguy]

That cutout is well past it's sell by date and really needs sorting, it's not accessible and the tails are PBJ- polybutyl jute covered. Basically rubber insulated but will probably be in half decent condition- still need replacing.
When it was installed it was probably all ok, but has been built over and boxed in etc. the dno will be able to help and at least change that old cutout!

 

[JBR]

The DNO gentleman has just visited.

BAS, yes, he said as much. Being rubber, they will have to be replaced. They may pull through the existing conduit or just install new PVC cables under the floor.
Oh, I'm certain the old box must have been there well before we came here 10 years ago. I wouldn't be at all surprised if it was put in when the house was built in the 1920s - and maybe even on a DC supply! I don't know how early AC came into use around here.
If they replace any fuses in the old box with solid links, won't that mean that the (new) connecting cables to the meter/CU won't be protected?

Taylortwocities, he did measure the earth resistance(?) which came out at 0.34 (Ohms?). He assures me that this is safe, being well under the 0.8 limit. Looking closely, there is a bare earth wire from the supply end of the conduit to somewhere behind the old wooden board. I shouldn't be surprised if they replace that as well. He did mention something about digging up outside as well - presumably that will involve our drive.

Guitarguy, the old rubber cables at the meter/CU end do look outwardly at least to be in reasonably good nick but, as you say, will need replacing anyway.
That's what surprised me: the fact that, not only is the old box under some loose floorboards (which may have been acceptable at the time), but that in the meantime (long before we arrived) a fitted wardrobe was installed directly above the area. I know nothing, but I would have thought that the old box should have been accessible. It is now anyway!

The DNO gentleman told me he'd be submitting a report (and another photograph) and that the people who do the remedial work will be in touch, although they tend not to rush too much unless it's a dire emergency. He advised me to call them tomorrow or Wednesday to see what's happening, and to tell them that my wife is worried sick. B***er that, I'M worried sick!
Good news: they will pay for it all!

Again, I can't thank you all enough for all your interest in our predicament.

 

[westie101]

I suspect they will install a new service from outside the property to the meter position following the existing cable in then via the conduit.
This will do away with the old box completely.

If you have an SK post code I did spot the job on the system earlier

I wonder if as originally built that the box found under the floor was actually in the room with the meter & CU. Then a previous owner decided to alter it all to suit possibly changing what was a lounge or something into what is now a bedroom & moving the meter etc to where it is now?

In the earlier photos it looks as though the room may have had a fitted bed head which covered an existing socket, so work was undertaken to provide the two that are there.
The size of the unpapered area seems to fit that.

 

[Taylortwocities]

He advised me to call them tomorrow or Wednesday to see what's happening, and to tell them that my wife is worried sick. B***er that, I'M worried sick!

As a bit of relief for your concerns. The way things are have been like it for a long time.

I am not saying that it does not need to be sorted, it does. But it is no more dangerous today than it was yesterday. It will go on being fine unless it is disturbed. So sleep well.

 

[plugwash]

The trouble with old rubber cable is that it goes hard and brittle.

As long as nothing disturbs it then it remains a very good insulator (and looks fine too) but a bit of movement and cracks will start opening up. Since it's basically impractical to gaurantee zero movement (houses are not 100% rigid) it should be replaced.

 

[JBR]

I suspect they will install a new service from outside the property to the meter position following the existing cable in then via the conduit.
This will do away with the old box completely.

If you have an SK post code I did spot the job on the system earlier

I wonder if as originally built that the box found under the floor was actually in the room with the meter & CU. Then a previous owner decided to alter it all to suit possibly changing what was a lounge or something into what is now a bedroom & moving the meter etc to where it is now?

In the earlier photos it looks as though the room may have had a fitted bed head which covered an existing socket, so work was undertaken to provide the two that are there.
The size of the unpapered area seems to fit that.

Wow! Yes, it is an SK postcode and, unless it's coincidentally some other problem, they must have put things in place very quickly!

Yes, that room could, I suppose, have been a living room, but it is remote from the kitchen - in fact, as far away as possible - so I doubt it. Nevertheless, perhaps you are right and the meter and fuse box could have been directly above the old metal box.

No, the area that looks like it could have been a fitted bed head is as a result of the removal of a fitted dressing table. On that point, a new dressing table is to take its place but will that junction box as it is now (or another in the same place under the socket) be acceptably accessible as it will end up behind a set of drawers? I understand that, to remain within the rules, junction boxes must be accessible for maintenance.

PS: Will you do the job?! You come across as very knowledgeable on here, if I may say so. No, only joking, it's a long way from Cumberland to Stockport!