Japan bombing 70 years on

[Brigadier]

Yes, I believe that China will be the next superpower.

Their economy is a farce and they will choke on their own pollution first.

I'm pretty sure, by some measure, China will be the next superpower (and I'll also bet that some Chinese well not see a paved road for one hundred years).
For anyone who chokes in pollution, another will take their place. China has historically placed little value on an individual's life.
Agree on the farce part - much of what China turns out is shoite, but they won't let it back in - the retailer sucks up the loss.

 

[JBR]

Another reason why I believe that China will continue to advance and progress is that they have introduced a 'one child family' scheme. I'm not sure what rewards/punishments exist to ensure this is effective but, assuming it works, the population will decrease by at least a half (possibly more if some couples have no children) in one generation.

Obviously, overpopulation is one of the greatest problems faced by that country which is why, of course, they introduced this incentive.

Another thing that occurs to me, having watched that documentary about Chinese teachers facing British schoolchildren(!), is that their society appears not to suffer from the severe problems (and not just in education) that we, and America for that matter, seem to have acquired. All down to lack of respect, in my opinion.

 

[ladylola]

The one child policy has by all accounts been largely adhered to and has gained some measure of acceptance as people see the logic in reducing population growth. Of the top of my head I seem to recall that the policy has resulted in several hundred million less Chinese than if they didn't have the policy.
However that may be about to change ....
http://www.theguardian.com/world/20...olicy-this-year-as-demographic-timebomb-looms

Seems 7+ billion of us isn't enough

 

[bernardgreen]

One of problems resulting from the one child policy is there are far more men than women as male children were prefereable and females were aborted or if born were left to die. Some baby girls were sent to orphanages, many were sold to foriegn adoptive parents.

Finding a wife is either difficult or expensive and this is shifting the balance of family life to more of a commercial relationship than an emotional relationship.

 

[AronSearle]

I'm pretty sure, by some measure, China will be the next superpower

China already is 'by some measure' a superpower, it is a great axis of the east.

But without reform, which there are no signs of happening, it will never the 'the' superpower.

It has serious pollution problems, not CO2, but poisen rivers, future water shortages and desertifercation problems.

Corruption is rife, coupled with their political system, I can't see their economy becoming more than just a cheap knock-off shop for goods, meaning they will always be dependant upon the sucess of other richer nations (they are trying to become a consumer nation, but are failing, and will continue to do).

 

[WalksWithTurkeys]

You underestimate China. They have a space programme, with considerable input from Russia at the start, but with plenty of Chinese input, and it may well surpass the Russian one, given that they plan to send Taikonauts to the moon.

Technically Chinese companies are leaping ahead, and quality on Chinese brands can be excellent. They are investing in research in universities, and education. The Chinese are in my experience very respectful people, well behaved, and wherever you have large Chinese populations you have success, think Hong Kong and Singapore. Chinese in Britain and America do very well.

There is corruption but they are supposed to be tackling it, executing those convicted for example.

Some people look down at the Chinese, but look at what happened here. In ~2007 the Western system nearly collapsed, it was by all accounts within days of doing so, due to systemic failings, which still exist.

 

[bernardgreen]

Very often the planning of a project looks only at how to achieve the result and has little if any consideration of adverse side effects that will be created by the project.

The Three Gorges Dam will create between 8 to 12 % of China's electricity and enable water transport reach further inland. It will also increase tourism as people travel to see the largest dam in the world ( ? ) But the new lake of static water will be a dumping ground for the pollution from the industrial operations discharge thier waste into the rivers feeding the lake. A lot of this pollution was "flushed" out of the river system when there was heavy rain and the rivers were fast flowing. Now it will just concentrate in the new lake.

 

[WalksWithTurkeys]

You are probably not old enough to remember, but this country had huge problems with pollution and health issues during our industrialisation. Since then we have largely cleaned up, mind you I don't go 'oop noworth' much, so maybe it's still a festering blackened mess up there.

 

[bernardgreen]

You are probably not old enough to remember

I am old enough to remember the smogs that blanketed London. Some of these were really thick and paralysed transport.

But while carbon and sulphur oxides were unpleasant and no doubt caused some damage to lungs these smogs were not laden with severely toxic chemicals.

I have also seen the results of the old East German industry's lack of consideration about how to safely dispose of toxic waste.

 

[WalksWithTurkeys]

You are probably not old enough to remember

I am old enough to remember the smogs that blanketed London. Some of these were really thick and paralysed transport.

But while carbon and sulphur oxides were unpleasant and no doubt caused some damage to lungs these smogs were not laden with severely toxic chemicals.

I have also seen the results of the old East German industry's lack of consideration about how to safely dispose of toxic waste.

I was referring to the 18th and 19th centuries. People regularly died due to toxins and dangerous working environments. Food was often adulterated, as sawdust was cheaper than flour, arsenic or some other toxin was added to boiled peas to make them look greener and so on.

 

[JBR]

There is corruption but they are supposed to be tackling it, executing those convicted for example.

Whilst the corruption in this country, especially involving government, seems to be increasing!

 

[AronSearle]

You underestimate China. They have a space programme, with considerable input from Russia at the start, but with plenty of Chinese input, and it may well surpass the Russian one, given that they plan to send Taikonauts to the moon.

So what, they have a space programme, and...?

Technically Chinese companies are leaping ahead

'Technically' in what way, what products are they inventing, what industries do they lead in?

and quality on Chinese brands can be excellent.

'can be', they can also be full of banned toxic materials and far from the declared and required quality standards (speaking as someone who has tested Chinese products)

but look at what happened here. In ~2007 the Western system nearly collapsed

Well, except that it wasn't more than a hiccup and it did not collapse.

Someone has Chinese rose tinted glasses.

You are probably not old enough to remember, but this country had huge problems with pollution and health issues during our industrialisation.

But we didn't have a billion people, didn't produce a fraction of the industrial volume of pollution that china produces, desertification and a government intent on spending billions on empty cities.

China's environmental problems are an order of magnitude greater than ours was.

 

[WalksWithTurkeys]

There is corruption but they are supposed to be tackling it, executing those convicted for example.

Whilst the corruption in this country, especially involving government, seems to be increasing!

We have a different form of 'corruption'. When you leave office, you hire yourself out to big corporations for a big wodge.

You underestimate China. They have a space programme, with considerable input from Russia at the start, but with plenty of Chinese input, and it may well surpass the Russian one, given that they plan to send Taikonauts to the moon.

So what, they have a space programme, and...?

Technically Chinese companies are leaping ahead

'Technically' in what way, what products are they inventing, what industries do they lead in?

and quality on Chinese brands can be excellent.

'can be', they can also be full of banned toxic materials and far from the declared and required quality standards (speaking as someone who has tested Chinese products)

but look at what happened here. In ~2007 the Western system nearly collapsed

Well, except that it wasn't more than a hiccup and it did not collapse.

Someone has Chinese rose tinted glasses.

You are probably not old enough to remember, but this country had huge problems with pollution and health issues during our industrialisation.

But we didn't have a billion people, didn't produce a fraction of the industrial volume of pollution that china produces, desertification and a government intent on spending billions on empty cities.

China's environmental problems are an order of magnitude greater than ours was.

I think you have anti-Chinese glasses on. Sorry, but our economy was on the verge of collapse. Look at America, they have massive problems with violence, poverty and pollution. And they contribute to massive pollution and violence in Africa and elsewhere. And it is questionable whether or not America is democratic, as one famous economist said, it is only partially democratic, being largely influenced if not controlled by big business. Not that most Americans would agree.

Regarding Chinese technology, a space programme is non trivial, and they have a high record of success. It indicates a high degree of organisation, technical skills and willingness to fund it. They have plans to land men (probably not women, they are too sensible to sign up) on the moon. Our own was for the most part a fiasco, and when we did get a satellite up, it was using what was essentially an American launcher design, the European one having repeatedly failed. (Due to our underfunding rather than lack of ability.) The Indians and Japanese have space programmes, but they have had a lot of failures. You might not have noticed but a large proportion of electrical goods are made in China. They were only made by American owned companies, or designed by American companies, then made in China, but now Chinese companies are taking over many areas, such as telecoms. There is in fact a real scare that Western telecoms infrastructure will be mostly Chinese, and that we do not know if they have designed the firmware and hardware to allow them to either take over or disable our comms in case of conflict. The Chinese government are spending huge amounts in science and technology, and the times they are a changin.

100 years ago we led the world. We had many firsts. Hi ho.

 

[bernardgreen]

Our own was for the most part a fiasco, and when we did get a satellite up, it was using what was essentially an American launcher design, the European one having repeatedly failed.

The Americans have the brute force to get the satellites into orbit but many of the satellites they launch are British designed and built.

Chinese space programs do have failures, but they are never reported to the public. Censorship prevents it. Censorship is rife in China, The TV station for Tienjin did not mention the explosions that had rocked the city until about ten hours after the event. One non Chinese news team was being turned away ( by force ? ) when they heard someone in authority making the comment " Do not let them report this to the world "

 

[AronSearle]

I think you have anti-Chinese glasses on. Sorry, but our economy was on the verge of collapse.

Then I suggest you go and find out what an economy is.

We were on the verge of a large recession, not a collapse, what was in danger was a 'paper' loss of many assets. Economical assets in technology, trade and intellectual properties where not at risk.

And the proof is in the pudding, the economy did not collapse, that it didn't and for the reasons why is proof of it's robustness.

And it is questionable whether or not America is democratic

Hyperbole.

Regarding Chinese technology, a space programme is non trivial, and they have a high record of success. It indicates a high degree of organisation, technical skills and willingness to fund it. They have plans to land men (probably not women, they are too sensible to sign up) on the moon.

All it shows is that they are good at spending money/resources on worthless bondoggles.

America is not the de-facto superpower because it has a space programme.

You might not have noticed but a large proportion of electrical goods are made in China.

'you might not have noticed', no mate, it is the point I am making.

They are just a knock-off nation, we design them, we market them, they make them for us.

Even China knows this, which is why they are investing heavily in trying to become a consumer led economy rather than an export led economy.

The Chinese government are spending huge amounts in science and technology, and the times they are a changin.

Call me when they have actually changed then, because so far you still haven't named any technological or economic fields that they actually LEAD in.