Vaillant still use the Giannoni. You can't get an existing system clean enough to satisfy this component even if you machine cleanse with hot water and DS40, hence why everyone uses a Magnaclean or similar. Even if you did you can't do anything about the damage done by the condensate. Have you serviced them? Take a look at the state of them each year.
'Best' Boiler ?
- Thread starter Ants
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I hardly install any boilers these days and mainly service & repair them. Keston, Ravenheat, WB, Vaillant. The only difference is some have deeper pockets than others enabling them to cover up their sh*t more effectively.
I think you have just given evidence as to what a crap product this particular item is; I did ask for good quality boilers that died within 5/10 years.
A broken hex on a newish boiler is hardly a write off, unless like the Response or the Elan, it is a poorly designed. Besides, I thought Vaillants had 10 year warrantee on the hex; that would make it a nuisance, but far from a write off.
The Vaillants weren't write offs. The HE's were changed but are £400 each they only have 2 year warranty. Hard to placate a punter who's previous boiler's HE was removed intact after being in service since the 80's.
I don't care to argue with you. I'm sure you do a good job, but I see all types of boilers and all I can say about the condensing ones (gas & oil) is that I don't like them. I don't like them because they look f***ed after such a short time even though they're maintained regularly.
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But you did say: " beyond economic repair", and good quality; clearly neither applies here.
It seems you don't like them for personal reasons, which is fine, but so far it looks like you join the ranks of those who can not support their opinion with facts.
You started off by asking me about real experiences. I've given you examples which have all made my customers eyes water. You then dismiss each of them, probably because they're not Worcesters. The world can't revolve around Worcester Bosch, however much they tell you it does. I like new technology and would embrace renewables if I could sell them. However the condensing boiler is just a cheaply mass-made product, scoring a few efficiency points to delay the inevitable fact that fossil fuel combustion products are in terminal decline .
How much further from your 20 years trouble free if 'installed & mainatined to spec' would you like it to be?
PS. The Greenstars I've serviced also look like they've been soaked in sea water and battery acid after a couple of years. WB advise only a flue pull test & FGA until test demands a clean. I doubt you'd get the thing apart if left that long.
I asked for examples of quality boilers installed and maintained to spec that were beyond economic repair.
Keston is utter crap.
Vokera is a typical budget boiler, and so is Main.
By your own judgment, the quoted Vaillant is over sensitive to dirt, others would say they simply failed because they were installed on dirty systems. Either way it is a flawed product design, and in case of the latter, not installed/maintained to spec.
I can't be bothered to check, but I doubt that the problem hex was used in the high end Vaillants.
Even if that had been the case, your examples are anecdotal and by no means prove or even suggest that every steamer is shortlived, because it is condensing. In fact, the existence of one single 20 year old steamer would disprove your statement.
For the third time, the Vaillants failed because of rot from the combustion side, not the water side so you can be as clean as you like. The condensate is beyond the control of the installer. It's supposed to cope with it. The high, low end etc doesn't exist. The only difference is the price you pay for the logo. I suspect any evidence would be anecdotal to you because you thought I'd never worked on condensing boilers so have to save yourself from being upstaged. I've also fitted Viessmann, Buderus and Worcester and can't see anything special in any of them. The Buderus seems to fall apart in your hands.
As for WB condensing oil. There aren't many who've fitted or worked on them who won't tell you they're poorly designed, cheaply made, perform like sh*t, soot up and are almost unserviceable. WB have had to re-designed it enough times too. Or does that not count either cos' it's oil.
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