I was thinking of cooling by convection being messed up, rather than obstructing the ventilation slots.
Installing socket under floor boards
- Thread starter davejuk
- Start date
Sponsored Links
Good idea. I have set a hardware monitor recording min/max temps with it up the right way. I'll run it upside down for 24 hours once thats done and see what the difference is. I shall report back.
Sorry, not picking on you, your's just happens to be the most recent such post, but this is just the sort of thing that's been complained about. The OP asked a specific question, only to be told that his whole plan is "wrong".
There is no such thing as "right" or "wrong" for this, and IMO the OP has a fairly reasonable setup. Why bother with off-site storage etc if you don't need it - I'm assuming it's not a "high valuables" store that needs such extreme measures. The Op has spotted the obvious flaw with many systems - you record images of the theft, only for those images to disappear down the street along with the rest of your goodies.
Probably the only thing I'd consider adding is something that the thieves can take that they might think actually is the recorder so they don't go looking for it. Oh, and I'd not be using Windows but then if the OP is happy with that then that's his choice to make, not mine.
Given that this is (I assume) going to be on his network, then physical access will not be required very often - images can be pulled from it via the network. That can be reduced even further if he has a means to remotely reset it, or remotely power it down.
Anyway, back to the original question ...
I can't see why it should be a problem - we don't seem to have any problem with JBs etc under floorboards, in attics, or in cupboards (as long as they are accessible for maintenance/inspection).
I can't see the equipment suffering from condensation - it will always be warmer than ambient (or as always as it's switched on). Other than condensation, being "too cold" is rarely a problem for most systems.
Obviously some kind of *nix OS would be best for 24/7 use, whether Linux, OS X or whatever. However, if configured carefully XP is a very stable OS for continuous use. I wouldn't leave it unattended for months on end - check in on it every so often and reboot every once in a while.
Also, it might be an idea to not have the PC connected to the internet, so no security hotfixes are required. I've found a bare XP SP2 install to be much more reliable than after all the hotfixes are applied. Obviously this might not be practical if you want remote access.
Colin C
Sponsored Links
And long may that continue.
Long may this site be the sort of place where when people come to ask questions which they think are limited in scope, because of their ignorance, their narrow-mindendess, their lack of imagination, or whatever, they get replies which ignore those limits and tell them things which they might not have thought or known about because of their self-imposed limits.
Yes, but...
The odds are against him not knowing, given the type of system he has chosen, but can you be absolutely sure that he is aware that there are other OSs than Windoze?
There is a big difference between :
a) Well what you've chosen will work, but have you considered ...
and
b) That's a pile of sh**e you should have done ...
So far, most of the answers in this thread are along the lines of b.
So, you are correct that it can be good to point out alternatives - provided you point them out as alternatives that the OP may or may not have considered. But that's not what's been happening here, people have been outright telling the OP that he should bin his plans (and what he's already got set up) and do something else.
That is neither helpful nor warranted.
Whether the OP has heard of non-Windows OSs I can't say. What I can say having read his posts is that he doesn't appear to be using an "appliance" - it's clearly a system he's put together to run this. That suggests to me that he's significantly above the level of "a computer is something you buy, switch on, and the internet is a big blue 'e'".
So when I said I wouldn't use Windows, I phrased it in such a way that it's my preference - I didn't phrase it in a manner to make it sound like Windows isn't a valid option which is the attitude others have taken.
a) Well what you've chosen will work, but have you considered ...
and
b) That's a pile of sh**e you should have done ...
So far, most of the answers in this thread are along the lines of b.
So, you are correct that it can be good to point out alternatives - provided you point them out as alternatives that the OP may or may not have considered. But that's not what's been happening here, people have been outright telling the OP that he should bin his plans (and what he's already got set up) and do something else.
That is neither helpful nor warranted.
Whether the OP has heard of non-Windows OSs I can't say. What I can say having read his posts is that he doesn't appear to be using an "appliance" - it's clearly a system he's put together to run this. That suggests to me that he's significantly above the level of "a computer is something you buy, switch on, and the internet is a big blue 'e'".
So when I said I wouldn't use Windows, I phrased it in such a way that it's my preference - I didn't phrase it in a manner to make it sound like Windows isn't a valid option which is the attitude others have taken.
ban-all-sheds: The assumptions you make are wrong and completely beside the point. I'm starting to think that this is just an exercise in increasing your post count. Your first post was a smart ass off-topic one liner, your second was a sarcastic stab at me, and in your third post you accuse me of being a bigot. You barely even attempt to discuss the topic at hand. You are a troll in this thread, even if you have made 37k posts over the last 9 years.
I am well aware of Linux and OSX. Unfortunately the camera manufacturer only supplies the software for Windows XP, or a $500 DVR unit. I don't know what OS their DVR unit runs. Windows has been absolutely rock solid though. I previously had it running 24/7 on a cheap (£100) laptop I picked up on eBay and it didn't crash once. All I have installed are the latest updates, anti-virus, and the recording software. Personally I like Windows. I know it's not for everyone but it does everything I want it to and I don't have any problems with it. Apples and Oranges.
If someone bought me a MacBook Pro then I would gladly take it but there's no way I'm going to drop 2 grand on a laptop. I have built a couple of Hackintoshes for friends but I haven't seen anything that makes me want to dual boot my own PC. They're great for graphic design work and music production but for what I use it for it's an unnecessary expense. Especially for a DVR, if the software was available.
I am well aware of Linux and OSX. Unfortunately the camera manufacturer only supplies the software for Windows XP, or a $500 DVR unit. I don't know what OS their DVR unit runs. Windows has been absolutely rock solid though. I previously had it running 24/7 on a cheap (£100) laptop I picked up on eBay and it didn't crash once. All I have installed are the latest updates, anti-virus, and the recording software. Personally I like Windows. I know it's not for everyone but it does everything I want it to and I don't have any problems with it. Apples and Oranges.
If someone bought me a MacBook Pro then I would gladly take it but there's no way I'm going to drop 2 grand on a laptop. I have built a couple of Hackintoshes for friends but I haven't seen anything that makes me want to dual boot my own PC. They're great for graphic design work and music production but for what I use it for it's an unnecessary expense. Especially for a DVR, if the software was available.
Fitting the PC under the floor boards will require care to avoid the fan filter becoming clogged with dust of which there is a lot in under floor boards.
And if no filter fitted then the components that the fan cools will become covered in a layer of dust which will then prevent them being cooled.
With luck the components will shut down before becoming too hot.
Dust filled power supplies on desks in dusty offices have shut down on over heat. But some have caught fire, fortunately during working hours.
Some TV sets have caught fire due to dust build up inside the set.
A small risk but not insignificant.
And if no filter fitted then the components that the fan cools will become covered in a layer of dust which will then prevent them being cooled.
With luck the components will shut down before becoming too hot.
Dust filled power supplies on desks in dusty offices have shut down on over heat. But some have caught fire, fortunately during working hours.
Some TV sets have caught fire due to dust build up inside the set.
A small risk but not insignificant.
This isn't a "PC" as most people would think of them. These Ion based systems are quite low power, and some models (including this one) are passively cooled - no fan on the processor heatsink.
There is a fan in the case, but I suspect that if he used an all-metal case, and mounted it vertically, then it would stay cool by convection alone. In fact, just spaced off the MDF, I think a metal case would stay cool enough on it's own - even horizontally.
There's a heck of a lot of lowish powered kit that stays tolerably cool without any active air movement.
As for dust buildup, I'll take the underfloor dust in preference to that above the floor. You can easily tell a PC that's been on the floor for a while - its insides look like the inside of a vacuum cleaner bag, which is because virtually all PCs are built with air flow that can be compared to a vacuum cleaner.
There is a fan in the case, but I suspect that if he used an all-metal case, and mounted it vertically, then it would stay cool by convection alone. In fact, just spaced off the MDF, I think a metal case would stay cool enough on it's own - even horizontally.
There's a heck of a lot of lowish powered kit that stays tolerably cool without any active air movement.
As for dust buildup, I'll take the underfloor dust in preference to that above the floor. You can easily tell a PC that's been on the floor for a while - its insides look like the inside of a vacuum cleaner bag, which is because virtually all PCs are built with air flow that can be compared to a vacuum cleaner.
The power goes off 
However, their mugs should already be on disk as they approached the house.
For this sort of machine, it would be trivial to add battery backup* which would avoid loss of recording, especially if at least some of the key cameras are fed from the same battery. For these mini-ITX type cases, the power supplies often run from a 12V 'brick', and some will deal with having a battery attached - ie it doesn't need an external UPS.
However, their mugs should already be on disk as they approached the house.
For this sort of machine, it would be trivial to add battery backup* which would avoid loss of recording, especially if at least some of the key cameras are fed from the same battery. For these mini-ITX type cases, the power supplies often run from a 12V 'brick', and some will deal with having a battery attached - ie it doesn't need an external UPS.
The PC power supply is an external brick. There is only a single case fan; no PSU or CPU fan. The PSU output is 5A @ 12V = 60W. Input is 1.5A.
The cameras are powered by a PoE switch. Its PSU input is 1.4A.
If just these two devices have power then the system operates as normal. Both of them are mounted on the same board so it would be easy to connect them both to a UPS.
Since I need 2.9A at 240V, should any UPS rated over 700VA do the job?
The cameras are powered by a PoE switch. Its PSU input is 1.4A.
If just these two devices have power then the system operates as normal. Both of them are mounted on the same board so it would be easy to connect them both to a UPS.
Since I need 2.9A at 240V, should any UPS rated over 700VA do the job?
FFS lighten up.
It wasn't really sarcasm.
No, in my 3rd post I suggested fixing battens to the joists for the box to sit on so that it would be the right way up and have air space around it.
And I said absolutely nothing about you in my 4th post.
Except that you probably did know about alternatives to Windoze
.
You mean at 230V - i.e. about 320W? I find it hard to believe that a few cameras would require anything like as much as that.
Whatever figures you end up with, you obviously would need to have a UPS rated to provide at least the amount of power being drawn. The thing to watch, however, is that standard UPSs sold for computers generally only have the capacity to supply their full load for a few minutes - basically for long enough to allow an 'orderly shutdown' of the computer. A UPS to allow extended periods of ongoing operation would be a totally different, and presumably costly, animal with a very big bulky battery.
Kind Regards, John.
Assuming input voltage is 230 volts then the input power is 345 watts suggesting a loss of 285 watts in the PSU.
With a bit more thought about the over all design of the system you should be able to achieve far less power wastage.
DIYnot Local
Staff member
If you need to find a tradesperson to get your job done, please try our local search below, or if you are doing it yourself you can find suppliers local to you.
Select the supplier or trade you require, enter your location to begin your search.
Are you a trade or supplier? You can create your listing free at DIYnot Local
Sponsored Links
