Is part P working?

[RF Lighting]

How many errors can you spot?

 

[Spark123]

Was it a straight swop or an upgrade?
1)Ze of 104 ohms on a TT is OK (unless you're NICEIC registered).
3)6mm is fine if the cable is mech protected (can go as small as 2.5mm)
4)Unable to comment, doesn't say anything about the size or how it is installed.
5)What has this got to do with a plumber replacing a shower?
7)ditto

 

[GaryMo]

3)6mm is fine if the cable is mech protected (can go as small as 2.5mm)

Agreed. It's surprising how the thought of an adiabatic equation frightens people into quoting sizes from table 54.7.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Ze of 104 ohms on a TT is OK (unless you're NICEIC registered).

Which Philip Holme Electrical Services is....

 

[milliamp]

Gary, are you sure the adiabatic can be used for sizing the main earth? I thought it was for protective conductors only

 

[GaryMo]

Yes, i'm sure.

 

[milliamp]

Thanks for that GaryMo, I need to check the book more often

 

[sm1thson]

The focus on the article seems to be that the plumber did not spot and sort out 'faults' on the electrical system and that he shouldnt be touching the electrics now the new regulations are out as he isnt 'qualified'.

Well before part P he still wasnt qualified and all of the 'faults' (relevant and correct or not) havent changed with part p, the issue is part p should mean that only registered people do the work or building control should be involved, which will highlight more errors. naturally when people arent registered and dont tell building control they can still do 'bodge jobs' as per here. In this instance he spotted the 'bodge job' and as such is reporting it to who -building control! well he couldnt have done that before part p so part p has helped even where people have ignored it.

 

[LiamPope]

My point of view is that of the DIY installer. I consider myself competent enough to do the work (I hold an electrical engineering degree and will fully verse myself with the 17th), though I am not a member of any Competent Person Scheme.

In my opinion Part P is spot on in not banning people like myself from carrying out work as long as building control is involved and carry out the necesary inspection and testing (getting the LABC to actually do that is another matter see my new thread!). If the regs were tightened to allow only qualified 'Competent Persons' to carry out work, how exactly would this stop cowboys/bodgers continuing to carry out unnotified, untested poor work? People who have no intention of following regs will continue to do so. Tightening up the regs to ban work by unqualified people altogether will only hurt people like myself who want to carry out 'DIY' work properly using the appropriate regulatory framework. Dont take that away!

Liam

 

[mattylad]

IMO part P is doomed to failure.

Part P appears (despite what BAS tells me) to require work to be done to
the regs BS7671 yet it is not publicly available for us to read without paying
what are not "diy" type fees.

IMO more people will still do electrical DIY not following the regs simply because they do not want to spend £65 on a book so they can move a socket etc.

 

[Chivers7]

Part P is not working IMHO mainly due to the average punter knowing nothing about it. If the Government and the registering bodies want it to work then they should spend money on advertising to make people more aware of it.

 

[Gasguru]

Part P is a total failure here in S.London. The situation has worsened since its introduction since qualified electricians don't stand a chance of getting the work when the Hungarians/Poles etc will happilly work illegally. Most kitchen and bathroom fitters I know also ignore Part P.

Exactly the same has happened with heating installers when updates to Parl L and GWN were introduced....anyone complying doesn't get the work (most corgis that do instalation work now just ignore many regs.).

Here's Fridays example...new kitchen refurb by the Poles. Plumbing/gas/electrics illegal. Inside the new trunking is 1mm T/E feeding the hob extractor (upwards) and the hob ignition and electric oven (downwards). Straight off the 30A fuse at the consumer unit. No seperate isolation or fusing. Exposed connector blocks above units, hob wired straight to oven. The extractor installation instructions were still unopened inside the unit.

Untitled

• Gasguru
• 22 Jul 2008
• 1

 

[ban-all-sheds]

IMO part P is doomed to failure.

That determination depends on what you believe its success criteria are...

Part P appears (despite what BAS tells me) to require work to be done to
the regs BS7671 yet it is not publicly available for us to read without paying
what are not "diy" type fees.

I've never denied that working to BS7671 is the easiest way for people to ensure compliance with the Building Regulations. The point about not being compelled to work to it means that people are free to only follow it partially, which means, crucially, that they cannot be compelled to do their own testing.

IMO more people will still do electrical DIY not following the regs simply because they do not want to spend £65 on a book so they can move a socket etc.

The regulations are useless for that purpose anyway - publications such as John Whitfields book, or The Part P Doctor, or the OSG, the EGTTBR, a decent DIY manual are of far more practical use.

And I do think that DIYers should put the effort in to learn - they don't need to become experts, but we see on an almost daily basis on this site the mess that people get into when they dive into DIYing without a ******* clue what they are doing. I'm sure the same people wouldn't assume that they could build the walls of a house, or strip down and rebuild a car engine without knowing a thing about it, so why do they with electrics?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Part P is not working IMHO mainly due to the average punter knowing nothing about it. If the Government and the registering bodies want it to work then they should spend money on advertising to make people more aware of it.

Not my taxes, thanks very much.

As it was a scheme devised by and for the registration bodies in order to increase their revenue and influence, let them pay for it.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

You're straying into racism, Gasguru - the nationality of a cowboy is irrelevant - cheap opportunistic labour will always seek to cut corners irrespective of ethnic background. I wonder how well our native-born tradesmen acquitted themselves when they went to Germany years back, slept in crowded low cost housing, undercutting the German workers and sending their money home?

The bad job you show was not bad because it was done by Poles - it was bad because it was done by chancers. In reality Polish electricians are better trained and more highly qualified than British ones....