neutral

[notb665]

My father-in-law who used to be an electrician says that the UK has the best and safest electrics in the world.

Is he right?

 

[AdamW]

I am just wondering how you can have a problem with a "neutral" being called a "neutral", yet your "ground" wire goes nowhere near a grinder of any sort. And shouldn't you upgrade your cabling if your phase conductor is "hot"? Obviously it isn't up to spec.

And why do AWG numbers get smaller for bigger conductors? Oh, and you should also get some kind of standardisation on your mains frequency, only there are plenty of places in the US that run on 50Hz. Don't you have a fully integrated and cross-linked electricity grid, or gas grid?

Talking of which, "gas" can only be used to refer to a gas. If referring to a liquid (perhaps petroleum) it would not be called "gas". Because it isn't a gas at the conditions at which one handles it.

I'm going to go and plug/unplug some of my superior UK mains plugs, generally regarded by most (not just Brits) to be the best and safest mains plugs in the world. But not in the bathroom. Cos bathroom sockets are a silly idea with any mains plug, even with our superior ones.

Please note this was all intended as tongue in cheek, I have nothing against America, quite the contrary in fact. But you should bear in mind that certain words sound nonsensical when spoken in a different dialect, or referring to different technical terms. Your dialect probably sounds strange to speakers of standard English! As I have shown above, the term "hot" makes no sense for a correctly installed electrical system. It sounds normal to you because it is what you are used to.

Another thing that sounds strange certainly to me: the "holiday season" is generally accepted to run from the end of July to the end of August. Because that's when families usually go on holiday. But a very Merry Christmas to you all the same. Alternatively, a joyous Alban Arthuan to you and may Artaius offer you a prosperous start to the new Sun.

 

[Thomasj845]

Thank you ninebob
Have a nice Holiday Season
Tom

 

[Thomasj845]

I have absolutely NO PROBLEM with the term of neutral.
All I was doing was expressing the function of an electrical neutral conductor which is_:
A CONDUCTOR THAT CARRIES UNBALANCED CURRENT.
Thats all there is to it.
Would you agree or dis agree that a neutral conductor is a conductor designed to carry unbalanced current?

TOm

 

[Stoday]

Would you agree or dis agree that a neutral conductor is a conductor designed to carry unbalanced current?

Disagree.

Within a house (in the UK) there is only one live wire; no second live wire to balance the load. Hence the neutral is designed to carry the full load current.

The method of distributing electricity to houses is fundamentally different in the US from Europe. The reason for the difference is that European voltages are twice those of the US. To distribute the same power, losses are FOUR times higher in the US.

Distribution transformers normally supply 100 or more households in the UK, unlike the US where the lower voltage means that each distribution transformer can only supply a handful of houses. Overall losses are in the same order as those in Europe because HV distribution is more extensive and LV distribution less extensive than in Europe.

 

[AdamW]

Would you agree or dis agree that a neutral conductor is a conductor designed to carry unbalanced current?

TOm

Would you agree or disagree that a "hot" conductor is a conductor designed to carry heat?

In the case of domestic mains systems the term "neutral" is used because of the p.d. between the conductor and earth, not the current along it. Now whilst current is of course the transfer of charge, the term "neutral" is not meant in that way in a mains system. Otherwise we would have to call the live wire positive or negative. Which of course would be a bit daft in an a.c. system where you have current moving along the live conductor in both directions over the course of a cycle.

The p.d. of neutral to earth should be zero, or as close to zero as practically feasible. Hence it is "neutral" between +340V and -340V (the peaks of domestic mains electricity).

So the term neutral is perfectly apt in this situation. As a matter of interest, what do you call a neutral conductor?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Would you agree or dis agree that a neutral conductor is a conductor designed to carry unbalanced current?

Disagree.

Would you agree that you should stop arguing with people about topics where they know more than you, and your position is based on a different way of doing things?

Oh - sorry - I forgot - that's the American Way, isn't it....

 

[Stoday]

But BAS the American way is always the best way.

If it's different, it's we who should change for the better.

 

[Thomasj845]

The question was NOT about any power going into UK homes.

The question was: What is a electrical neutral conductor designed to do?

THe electrical neutral conductor is designed to carry unbalanced electrical current, between 1 or more electrical phase conductors.

You people are inserting issues about every not related to a WHAT an electrical neutral conductor is designed to do.

Ever heard of Kirchoff's LAw ?

Wow you complicate the simple things. I wonder what response I would get if I inquired.
What is a an electrical switch? I bet you will see 1000 UK different definintions when there is ONLY ONE definition to what a switch is.
Wow!
Hope you all have an excellent Christmas Season. Does the UK get much snow like the US?

You brits are very nice to talk to, I like it here conversing with the UK network I think I am going to stay awhile, ok?
Tom

Oh in answer to someone's response, it appears that you do have a very safe electrical system using ONLY 2 wires for an electrical service.
Tom

 

[ban-all-sheds]

The question was NOT about any power going into UK homes.

Well - since this is a UK DIY forum, and since people tend to do DIY in their homes, rather than on 3-phase industrial supplies (we hope), and since our homes are supplied with single-phase electricity, and since the topic that excited you was about installing kitchen and bathroom extractor fans, then I think that this IS all about power going into people's homes.

We have a single-phase supply.

We call the two conductors Live and Neutral. You call yours Hot and Grounded, I believe?

The question was: What is a electrical neutral conductor designed to do?

THe electrical neutral conductor is designed to carry unbalanced electrical current, between 1 or more electrical phase conductors.

It's pretty hard to have an unalanced current between 1 phase conductor. And anyway - isn't Neutral also a phase conductor?

But let's say we have just the one phase conductor - we'll call it Live.

It is carrying current, and there is an imbalance between it, and, err... nothing, because we have no other phase conductor.

So the Neutral carries this unbalanced current.

Works for me.

Wow you complicate the simple things. I wonder what response I would get if I inquired.
What is a an electrical switch? I bet you will see 1000 UK different definintions when there is ONLY ONE definition to what a switch is.
Wow!

Try asking us what a 2-way switch is - you'll enjoy that.

Hope you all have an excellent Christmas Season. Does the UK get much snow like the US?

Yes - at Christmas parts of the UK get as much snow as Florida.

Oh in answer to someone's response, it appears that you do have a very safe electrical system using ONLY 2 wires for an electrical service.
Tom

It's usually very safe, up to the point that it enters peoples' houses, when all of a sudden there are dozens of wires, all over the place, and this can confuse some of them.

 

[Thomasj845]

ban-all-sheds
Wow out of all the responses (ban-all-sheds) you get A+ for understanding
what a neutral conductor is. Thank You

Your 2 way switch is our 3 way switch.
Ours is called a 3 way because it needs 3 wires to function: Thats where the
the 3 way was developed because it was designed for a 3 conductor circuit. The 3 wires lets an electrical circuit operate a ceiling luminaire from 2 locations.

What is your 2 way switch and how many wires does it need to function?

Have a good evening All!
Tom

 

[breezer]

What is your 2 way switch and how many wires does it need to function?

3 between switches, have a look here

 

[SwindonSpark]

In case you are lost in this thread, here's a picture: -

 

[Thomasj845]

10 amp on hot#1
10 amp on hot#2
00 amp on the neutral

and

10 amp on hot#1
25 amp on hot#2
15 amp on the neutral

so you can see that the neutral is designed to carry unbalanced current

Thank you for submitting the electrical schematic Very Nice
You Brits are A ok!

 

[Stoday]

Your 2 way switch is our 3 way switch.

This is all very interesting, Tom

So presumably our intermediate switch is what you'd call a four way switch because it has four terminals?