Spurred on but what about the warrantee?

[Big Tone]

I’ve got a job to do for someone tonight which strictly speaking would be best done by fitting a spur, but I am considering doing it a different way.

I’m going to fit a brand new dishwasher under someone’s kitchen counter. A spur could easily come down from the double socket above the counter but this means breaking tiles; tiles for which she has no replacement! (I’m sure others have been here before)

When I say “easily” it would mean digging out a channel to run down under the tiles & plasterwork and past the counter underneath to mount the spur for the dishwasher; obviously. Not a big deal but it’s going to be messy, time-consuming, more expense, but most of all it’ll look like poop because she hasn’t any matching tiles.

The way I have seen others do it is simply to drill a small hole through the counter close to the wall just large enough for the 13 amp flex to pass through. The dishwasher just plugs into the existing sockets above the counter and has the advantage of easy access to switch off/on at the wall. But because the dishwasher has a moulded plug I’d have to cut that off in order to thread the wire through and reattach a different plug. (Uh oh!)

Now I don’t see any problem with this and people here will understand I haven’t compromised any electric safety, provided I do it right of course. However, if the machine broke down would the manufacturer honour any warrantee or will some jobs-worth say it’s null and void just because it’s got a different plug on the end?

Incidentally, while I’m at it, I have considered also making the lead longer by using an in-line 13 amp 3 pin flex connector to make getting in behind the washer easier to fit or clean/service.

What I’m proposing is only what I have seen others do on occasion in the past. So it’s neither original nor dangerous as far as I am aware, but I am concerned about the warrantee more than anything else.

 

[JohnW2]

The way I have seen others do it is simply to drill a small hole through the counter close to the wall just large enough for the 13 amp flex to pass through. The dishwasher just plugs into the existing sockets above the counter and has the advantage of easy access to switch off/on at the wall. But because the dishwasher has a moulded plug I’d have to cut that off in order to thread the wire through and reattach a different plug. (Uh oh!) ... Now I don’t see any problem with this and people here will understand I haven’t compromised any electric safety, provided I do it right of course. However, if the machine broke down would the manufacturer honour any warrantee or will some jobs-worth say it’s null and void just because it’s got a different plug on the end?

If you really 'had' to do it in that sort of way, but were worried about cutting off the plug, have you considered running a short length of flex through that hole in the worktop, with a plug at the top and a ('trailing' or fixed) socket underneath (i.e. a short 'extension lead', which went through the worktop)? Pretty 'orrible, but .....!!

Kind Regards, John.

 

[Big Tone]

Thanks John

I did wonder that but thought a hard-wired connector would be more reliable with less contact resistance and therefore better with an appliance which draws lots of current? (I’m more of an electronics guy than electrics; although I have the 17th ed on paper).

It would preserve the original plug though, so maybe I’ve been a bit daft not just going for your obvious suggestion.

 

[danechip]

If this were my kitchen, I would be inclined to totally remove the flex and add a new length with your my plug, keeping the original and moulded plug aside. It could be switched over then should the machine go wrong in the future ?

 

[westie101]

So while you were positioning the appliance the plug got accidentally damaged so was replaced! Where's the problem with that?

 

[JohnW2]

Thanks John ... I did wonder that but thought a hard-wired connector would be more reliable with less contact resistance and therefore better with an appliance which draws lots of current? (I’m more of an electronics guy than electrics; although I have the 17th ed on paper). ... It would preserve the original plug though, so maybe I’ve been a bit daft not just going for your obvious suggestion.

It obviously would mean that there would be two plug/socket connections, hence two opportunities for contact resistance issues, but you're going to have one plug/socket anyway.

I think it's crazy that we have to worry about the fact that replacing a plug 'could affect a warranty'. In reality, I would think that one could nearly always (eventually) successfully argue that such an action could not possibly result in a fault arising in the appliance, but we live in a world in which that argument could possibly be protracted and tedious. One would hope, however, that most manufactirers are not that silly - so the risk of a real problem is probably fairlly low.

Kind Regards, John

 

[Big Tone]

So while you were positioning the appliance the plug got accidentally damaged so was replaced! Where's the problem with that?

I thought that too, but I've got a feelin in me water that some nob will find any reason/excuse for not paying out or fixing it. That's the way things are these days, it's like pulling teeth. Maybe I've watched too much Don't get done get Dom programs...

 

[knowall]

If the appliance is fused according to the manufacturer's instructions and the replacement plug is wired correctly, why worry?

Regards,

NA

 

[JohnW2]

If the appliance is fused according to the manufacturer's instructions and the replacement plug is wired correctly, why worry?

Because, as has been said, some (hopefully not many) manufacturers/ insurers will drag one through endless grief before (hopefully!) eventually having to accept that replacing (satisfactorily) a plug cannot possibly have caused an appliance to develop a fault. Worse, many consumers (often, as always, the 'most vulnerable') are intimidated don't fight, and merely accept that their 'unauthorised modification' to the appliance has invalidated the warranty. Yes, it's all crazy, but it happens.

Kind Regards, John

 

[Big Tone]

That's right John; my take exactly.

Just got back. When I got there the plug was cut off, so I had to go with my first plan.

My Gas Safe CH engineer friend went in before me earlier today to plumb it in. (He's who got me the small wiring job).

I'd told him what I might do and he'd kindly drilled a hole in the right place. He also cut the plug off for me because he said "the lead wasn't long enough to reach the plug above the counter anyway"

Que: Is copper sooo expensive and profit margins sooo small that manufacturers will only use less than a yard of wire now?

So, it would seem, dishwashers are built with the intention of only ever being plugged into a spur under a counter... (Bangs head).

 

[JohnW2]

Que: Is copper sooo expensive and profit margins sooo small that manufacturers will only use less than a yard of wire now?

Who knows?! They would probably argue that the short leads are 'for safety reasons', to reduce the chances of it getting trapped under the appliance, or wherever!

Kind Regards, John

 

[knowall]

O, you've done it now !

NA

 

[Big Tone]

Que: Is copper sooo expensive and profit margins sooo small that manufacturers will only use less than a yard of wire now?

Who knows?! They would probably argue that the short leads are 'for safety reasons', to reduce the chances of it getting trapped under the appliance, or wherever!

Kind Regards, John

Trouble is and in truth, even if there was a socket at the back on the wall just twelve inches from the floor it would have been a tight struggle to get past the machine and get the plug in! (More head banging).

Come to think of it, most appliances I see these days have ridiculously short leads.

 

[winston1]

Que: Is copper sooo expensive and profit margins sooo small that manufacturers will only use less than a yard of wire now?

Who knows?! They would probably argue that the short leads are 'for safety reasons', to reduce the chances of it getting trapped under the appliance, or wherever!

Kind Regards, John

Trouble is and in truth, even if there was a socket at the back on the wall just twelve inches from the floor it would have been a tight struggle to get past the machine and get the plug in! (More head banging).

Come to think of it, most appliances I see these days have ridiculously short leads.

Cutting the plug off does not invalidate the warranty. Anyway the warranty is in addition to your statuary rights which are longer than the warranty.

 

[OwainDIYer]

your statuary rights