Smart Meters

Didn't even think of a monitor. I had my smart meters installed to stop the aggro of submitting monthly readings. The device came free. 'Big brother' will be charging me £200 whether I want one or not. If it's infrasructure, it'll be in the costs and we'll all pay anyway.
 
This is all down to Cameron being bamboozled by the big 6. It's cheaper for them to lay off the meter readers, easier for them to cut you off remotely if you don't pay the bill, and only saves you having to send in the meter readings. A smart meter makes you a bit more aware of you're usage, but anyone that switches lights off automaticaly, doesn't need one.

The first generation was hackable by a foreign power, so GCHQ has helped solve that problem, but come 2021, prices will rise, and you'll be charged a higher fee for sending in your own readings if you don't fit one.
 
Didn't even think of a monitor.
That's probably Bas' point.

I had my smart meters installed to stop the aggro of submitting monthly readings.
I've seen a lot of people say that. Do you not have quarterly bills?
You could just amend estimated readings annually if you wanted.

The device came free. 'Big brother' will be charging me £200 whether I want one or not.
That is true - a Government issue.

If it's infrasructure, it'll be in the costs and we'll all pay anyway.
That is not the way companies work when they become huge.

You are not a customer any longer. You have to pay upfront for the privilege of using their product.
 
Yeah, quarterly paper billing. That'll be cheaper, won't it! :ROFLMAO: Well, if there weren't progress, we'd still be putting shillings in the meter.
 
Oh those were the days, but wasn't electricity cheaper then, so just how much has progress really helped us.
 
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:?:
 
Yes, I find my Owl useful for that. It cost me about a tenner (used) on fleabay. It's very obvious if the oven or a heater has been left on, but accurate enough to show lightbulbs overnight.

Your existing electricity meter will do all that and you don't need to pay a tenner for it.
 
my electricity meter is not in my living quarters. It's in the garage.
 
About 12 years ago I was a BG customer, one day I got a bill for over £3500 (usual bill was £300ish pa) and a letter asking me to increase my direct debit to £300+ pm. I rang up to complain and was stonewalled, they suggested I might have built a heated swimming pool, and was warned if I didn't pay they would cut me off. It transpired over the next few days that I was one of 1000's of customers that had received these crazy bills. The attitude of BG only changed after the chairman was dragged to parliament to explain this nonsense. The MP's made him admit they had messed up and he promised to stop threatening people. This whole process had taken over 12 months. It was quite incredible the mans only reaction before had been to question how these people had time to make all the complaining phone calls, as it was costing BG a fortune hiring temporary staff to answer the phones.

I'm sure that attitude has not changed and given the same circumstance they would switch off the smart meter. And remember, as I mentioned above, my power would have been OFF for over 12 months.

Be interesting to hear if anyone else was caught up in this fiasco.
 
Yeah, that's right. Same people that have to be told that eating too much makes them fat, smoking can give them cancer, drinking too much can give rise to liver problems... Sod them eh? Just worry about yourself mate.
An analogy so poor that it clearly indicates the lack of reasoning in your argument.
 
I bought a plug in energy meter, what I wanted was a meter which included time, well I suppose really the reverse one which did not include time, a watt is a joule per second, what I wanted was to measure joules rather than watts, although since we tend to use a weird unit called a kWh that was good enough for me. 360 seconds in an hour so 360 joules = 1 kWh this is a metric system?

Anyway whole idea is to see over a set time how much is used. It is near impossible to work out how much is costs to wash cloths, as the power used goes up and down during the wash, with the plug in meter I could find out the cost of doing a wash, and any other item which switches on and off. So when brewing beer I could work out on a very cold day I needed 5 watt average to maintain the fridge temperature to 20°C so I then knew I could use an 8 watt bulb to maintain the temperature, I did not need a 20 watt heater, by reducing the size of heater I also reduced the hysteresis so there was a valid point in measuring.

Be if a faulty freezer, or working out size of heater the energy meter has a use. However to have the energy meter connected to whole house is rather pointless, yes you have used 5 kWh in 24 hours, but you really have no idea what used those 5 kWh, you can read the power something uses from the label, what you can't read is how long it uses that power for.

Since all gas is used by central heating then with gas it is different. But with electric too many items are on the same meter for it to do any good.

Even central heating, it would be nice to know how much can be saved by better controlling the temperature of each room. However my attempts at controlling individual rooms temperatures showed it's not that easy, with a fan heater you can quickly heat and allow rooms to cool, but fact you are moving the air around means you could be losing more energy, with radiators without a fan, switch it off and it can take hours to cool down, and hours to heat back up again, we see efficiency ratings of electric heating based on this idea, so 100% efficient is a radiant heater aimed at people in the room only on when room occupied, however there is a control problem. So if a room is used for 4 hours, and it takes an hour to warm up, then 4/5 = 80% efficient. Use the room for longer and efficiency goes up.

So take a room not used after 8 am until 10 pm i.e. bedroom and if you can turn off the heating for part of that time then you save money, but it also gets heat from rest of house and takes time to heat and cool, so if set to 18°C and it cools to 16°C then take a centre point so work on what is saved by cooling room for 1°C for 14 hours, it is actually very little saving, but the point is a meter working out what all rooms use, is going to tell you nothing, what you want is a meter recording room by room to be able to use the information to do any good, if you can work out it will save £20 per year to allow room to cool and re-heat it, and the device required to do that will cost £40 then you know you will get your money back in 2 years. But cost of heating whole house is useless, it does not give you anything which can be used.
 
I still don't get what's in it for the customer.
That's because in reality there isn't anything in it for the customer - or at least, very little.
It's primarily about "demand management" which is industry speak for making users adjust their usage to match available generation rather than generating the amount of lecky that people are using. They already do that with industrial customers by offering discounts for interruptible supplies, smart meters are to do much the same for domestic customers by persuading people that they don't want to eat tea at tea time on those cold winter evenings because the lecky is now 10x the usual price. And if that fails, they can remotely turn you off.

The think about these meters being installed is ... if they can be upgraded in-situ then they can f**k right off* ! If the suppliers can upgrade them in situ then so could anyone else - with "modified" firmware.
Not that I'll have one for them to upgrade anyway.
 
Pity it won't work in a screened enclosure ;)
And for the moment, TPTB have backed down from making them mandatory. Not that they'll be finished by 2020 anyway - especially when they have to go back and replace all the ones installed to date (and in the next year or so) because they don't work with the network (as per the original post in this thread).
 

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