20 point Gaza peace plan (Is Trump one step closer to Nobel Peace Prize?)

[MNW67]

An interesting and straight forward analysis here.

It might come down to whether the other side trusts Netanyahu. I wouldn't!

The 5 big problems with Trump’s Gaza peace plan

Both sides are tired of war. But an asymmetrical plan lacking details could easily be derailed, especially given how little trust exists between both sides.

theconversation.com

 

[Munroast]

Very sadly for the good people of Gaza (which will be the vast majority) Hamas will vote for more of the same, they're having the time of their lives (and even death is not feared due to their extreme religious beliefs). So very sadly there will be no peace and Israel will continue with its over-the-top brutality of the Gaza civilians.

And I still don't thing granting Palestinians recognition as a sovereign state has helped at all, Hamas will argue this was a victory and it has all ben worth it. Recognition should have been on the table as part of that peace deal.

 

[fillyboy]

And I still don't thing granting Palestinians recognition as a sovereign state has helped at all, Hamas will argue this was a victory and it has all ben worth it. Recognition should have been on the table as part of that peace deal.

I haven't looked at the various countries but certainly the UK's recognition of Palestine is conditional on Hamas not being part of it.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

I'm just listening to it at the moment intending to start a thread on it, thank you for beating me to it.
It's a major turning point in many ways, it's obviously an opportunity for a better future in the middle east, it all hinges on Hamas relinquishing power and releasing the hostages.

It all hangs on Israel withdrawing from Gaza.

Watch out for those who object to it and decry it, those on here that do that only wish to destroy Israel and perpetuate the violence.
Trumps done a good job on this (as has Jared Kushner), they should be applauded.
Well done.

A good job would have been a negotiated settlement, which would have involved Hamas or their representatives..
This is a take it or we'll continue with the genocide offer.

And Netanyahu has always scuppered previous opportunities.
There's plenty of opportunities in this offer for Netanyahu to scupper yet.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

I dearly hope the conflict can end for the poor people of Gaza, they are in a living hell.

And let’s not forget those hostages and their families.

Palestinians as well as Israelis.

The offer includes the return of dead Palestinian remains that Israel holds.
How and where did they die, for Israel to hold their remains? We know that Israel does not attempt to recover Palestinians bodies in Gaza, nor the West Bank.

 

[fillyboy]

Watch out for those who object to it and decry it, those on here that do that only wish to destroy Israel and perpetuate the violence.

 

[Munroast]

I haven't looked at the various countries but certainly the UK's recognition of Palestine is conditional on Hamas not being part of it.

hmmm - not sure
there was a statement in September. That the UK now recognises Palestine as a sovereign state (or at least declares recognition). But that recognition comes with political caveats about Hamas not having a place in the governance of that state.

so as of 'now' do we or don't we, because hamas is still there?

 

[fillyboy]

hmmm - not sure
there was a statement in September. That the UK now recognises Palestine as a sovereign state (or at least declares recognition). But that recognition comes with political caveats about Hamas not having a place in the governance of that state.

so as of 'now' do we or don't we, because hamas is still there?

a lot of countries recognised Palestine as a State long before us and the other recent additions. It's still not a State, Gaza doesn't have a Govt recognised by the International community, the West Bank might have.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

Eh?

Netanyahu has been perpetuating the violence for almost 2 years.

The plan is the same as that Biden negotiated for a truce.

It is more akin to the "framework" his predecessor Joe Biden announced in May 2024 to try to get a phased ceasefire and agreement to end the war. In that case, it was another eight months before Israel and Hamas implemented a truce and hostage and prisoner exchange.

Trump's Gaza plan is a significant step - but faces fundamental obstacles

The proposal may shift the focus towards negotiation, but longstanding issues mean achieving peace will be difficult.

www.bbc.com

Don't expect any plan to come to fruition for many months yet.

This conflict has nothing to do with Gaza or Hamas and everything to do with Netanyahu clinging to power.

Netanyahu's political existence will be very much at th eforefront of his concerns.
But acceptance of Trump's principles alone is not the same as actually ending the war. And while Netanyahu rejects this accusation, his domestic opponents say he has form for spiking an emerging deal if it endangers his political survival at home.

Trump's Gaza plan is a significant step - but faces fundamental obstacles

The proposal may shift the focus towards negotiation, but longstanding issues mean achieving peace will be difficult.

www.bbc.com

The plan only refers to the two state solution in passing. This is a key issue for Hamas, and the rest of the world, as well as an Israeli withdrawal. But there is more than sufficient excuses for Israel to deny acceptance of any way towards recognising a Palestine State.

Palestinian statehood is mentioned, but only in the vaguest of terms. The plan suggests that if the Ramallah-based Palestinian Authority is reformed, conditions "may finally be in place for a credible pathway to Palestinian self-determination and statehood".

Trump's Gaza plan is a significant step - but faces fundamental obstacles

The proposal may shift the focus towards negotiation, but longstanding issues mean achieving peace will be difficult.

www.bbc.com

In Churchillian language:

Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning.

 

[Vinty]

So you accept it’s a surrender proposal not a peace plan.

Basically,it's a case of, surrender and we will stop killing your people.
It doesn't address the root causes of the conflict.

 

[fillyboy]

Basically,it's a case of, surrender and we will stop killing your people.
It doesn't address the root causes of the conflict.

It paves the way for addressing those root causes in the future surely.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

I haven't looked at the various countries but certainly the UK's recognition of Palestine is conditional on Hamas not being part of it.

I have asked before for a link to these apparent conditions, and i don't mean the jerusalem Times.
I mean reputable sources.
But you tend to disappear when asked for them.

The UK has formally recognised Palestine as a state in a major shift in policy.
The UK has recognised Palestine as a state, acknowledging all the legal rights and obligations of statehood.

What recognising a Palestinian state actually means

Sir Keir Starmer has announced that the UK will recognise Palestine ahead of the United Nations General Assembly. Here's what the decision means.

news.sky.com

a lot of countries recognised Palestine as a State long before us and the other recent additions. It's still not a State, Gaza doesn't have a Govt recognised by the International community, the West Bank might have.

The only blockage for Palestine to be recognised as an independent state is the US veto on the UN Security Council.

 

[diy_fun_uk]

What do you think about the Board of Peace and Blair being part of it?

I saw a Palestinian guy on a news prog last night, and he suggested this (not Blair but the whole premise of the Board) could be one of the stumbling blocks, asserting they (the Palestinians) should be managing things themselves with assistance from other countries.

Why is ex-UK PM Tony Blair involved in Trump's Gaza recovery plan?

US President Donald Trump has unveiled his proposed peace plan for Gaza — pitching the return of a former British prime minister as its coordinator.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Notch7]

Watch out for those who object to it and decry it, those on here that do that only wish to destroy Israel and perpetuate the violence.

false argument

it is Netanyahu that has perpetuated the violence

 

[Notch7]

You spoke too soon.

there are no Jew haters on this forum

there are however lots of Muslim haters