20 point Gaza peace plan (Is Trump one step closer to Nobel Peace Prize?)

[charliegolf]

Netanyahu has already been on Telegram rolling back the rhetoric. He has immediately refused to contemplate a 2 state solution; has contradicted the fact that the IDF will withdraw and more.

I, like everyone hope it will work. But hope is not a plan.

 

[charliegolf]

Palestine at this point in time is still not a state, regardless of who recognises it as one. If Hamas can be removed, there is a clear pathway for Palestine officially gaining statehood.
I hope that happens and Palestine does go onto becoming a state.

Be better if Hamas were in the talk, not just dictated to. And before the, "So, you want to negotiate with terrorists then!", derision rolls over me- ask the people of NI how things are now, having done just that leading to the GFA.

 

[Brigadier]

The pessimist in me imagines Hamas sleepers in whatever Palestinian government is formed.

Would that be justification enough though, to abandon efforts towards peace?
(It is the same "reasoning" used by those who are anti-immigration; "Why risk even one criminal coming in?")

After all, you can't easily eradicate an ideology.

 

[diy_fun_uk]

Would that be justification enough though, to abandon efforts towards peace?
(It is the same "reasoning" used by those who are anti-immigration; "Why risk even one criminal coming in?")

After all, you can't easily eradicate an ideology.

No.

 

[Brigadier]

No.

Sorry, it was a rhetorical question (towards you in my opinion, anyway).

But Bibi and his ultra-right colleagues have been using this "logic" all along.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

It is a pre condition

They won’t recognise if……

Show me where it says that, from a reputable source, not the Jerusalem Times.

The UK has formally recognised Palestine to protect the viability of a two-state solution and create a path towards lasting peace for the Israeli and Palestinian people.

UK formally recognises Palestinian State

The UK has formally recognised Palestine to protect the viability of a two-state solution and create a path towards lasting peace for the Israeli and Palestinian people.

www.gov.uk

 

[fillyboy]

Be better if Hamas were in the talk, not just dictated to. And before the, "So, you want to negotiate with terrorists then!", derision rolls over me- ask the people of NI how things are now, having done just that leading to the GFA.

But the Palestinian Authority Govt can't work with Hamas and vice versa, and even with Hamas gone you still have Islamic Jihad. As for the GFA Tony Bin Blair was one of the biggest players in that, so I'm minded to support his and Jared Kushner's plan.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

Palestine at this point in time is still not a state, regardless of who recognises it as one. If Hamas can be removed, there is a clear pathway for Palestine officially gaining statehood.
I hope that happens and Palestine does go onto becoming a state.

They are already recognised as a State by 157 out of 193 countries.

They could become a fully fledged member of the UN, but for the US's vetoi in the Security Council.

The only lever that UK could now apply to Palestine is a) to withdraw political relations, or as a further more harsh step to derecognise Palestine as a State.

States may withdraw diplomatic recognition of another state...
There is no clear consensus on the legality of derecognition...
Withdrawal of recognition of a government is a more severe act of disapproval than the breaking of diplomatic relations.

Diplomatic recognition - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Knave of Hearts]

If you take away its raison d'etre, you can make it irrelevant.

It will then wither to effectively nothing.

It's raison d'etre was opposition to the Israeli occupation.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

No, but to disarm them, exile them and remove them from Govt is a first step, de radicalising Palestine would be a further step, it's been done in other Arab countries.
As you say, none of us knows what will happen 5 years down the line, but if in the meantime the Palestinians lot in life improves significantly, there's more chance of them existing peacefully beside Israel, other Arab countries have done it, Egypt and Jordan being good examples.

Israel repeatedly attacks its neighbours. Syria, Lebanon, Yemen, Iran, Qatar.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

I have not really thought about what it means before. But a quick Google seems to show that the most important thing will be getting recognised as a state by the United Nations. And that can only happen if the USA doesn't veto. So, hopefully if this deal works then somewhere (a long way) down the line, Palestine will get recognised at the UN.

Not unless USA disagrees with Israel, because Israel will not agree to the two state solution.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

The pessimist in me imagines Hamas sleepers in whatever Palestinian government is formed.

Hamas has a political wing and a military wing.

 

[diy_fun_uk]

It's all very interesting.

Trump wants it all sorted now, as in now (well, three or four days)
However as the talking heads are saying on news progs, Netanyahu is still very much considering his/Israel's options.
And Hamas still considering theirs.

In a sense, neither wants to lose face, however certainly from Netanyahu's perspective, he needs to consider Trump.

 

[fillyboy]

They are already recognised as a State by 157 out of 193 countries.

They could become a fully fledged member of the UN, but for the US's vetoi in the Security Council.

The only lever that UK could now apply to Palestine is a) to withdraw political relations, or as a further more harsh step to derecognise Palestine as a State.

Diplomatic recognition - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

They are still not a state. Gaza is currently being rum by a terrorist organisation.

 

[Knave of Hearts]

They are still not a state. Gaza is currently being rum by a terrorist organisation.

It's under Israeli occupation. There is no functioning government, except for that provided by the occupiers, who are busy committing genocide.

So yes, it is being run by a terrorist organisation.
It's called Israeli-Occupied Territories.

Israeli-occupied territories - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org