Mandatory ID cards (Brit Card) to be announced tomorrow

[carmanmemoranda]

this sounds like the CCTV debate. here is an article from the overlords themselves. the same logic applies. there are far more points than this too.

“If you’ve done nothing wrong…”: 5 Reasons Why This is No Defence for Surveillance – Surveillance Camera Commissioner’s Office

The expression “if you’ve done nothing wrong you’ve nothing to worry about” is not the answer to legitimate public concern over surveillance. Here are 5 reasons for abandoning the argument once and for all.

videosurveillance.blog.gov.uk

When I go abroad to certain places I'm routinely asked, when did I travel to xyz country? What was the reason for my visit?

I never signed up to giving this info about myself away, but people in other countries know, so I'm sure this country does too

The info is out there, it's just being organized better.

Right or not can be argued forever, but don't pretend it's not yet known

 

[carmanmemoranda]

i am not saying that, i was responding to it minions claims that the data will be stolen if we do not embrace it. whatever data he is referring to is what i am talking about.
i assume what he has in mind is somebody using your digital ID to get work, or for whatever other freedoms that they will slowly make it mandatory for.
my life will also not change. i will not use their ID and nothing for me will change, even if somebody does steal my ID, i don't care, it won't effect me,

It will if it happens. New id system or not

i don't live the kind of life where these things effect me in the slightest

You do, just maybe you don't realize it.

Do you have a house, car, money, bank account ?

 

[IT Minion]

so by your own logic the data is at risk of being stolen

Your identity is always at risk of being stolen. Therefore you say we can't have a driving license?

 

[aveatry]

this sounds like the CCTV debate. here is an article from the overlords themselves. the same logic applies. there are far more points than this too.

“If you’ve done nothing wrong…”: 5 Reasons Why This is No Defence for Surveillance – Surveillance Camera Commissioner’s Office

The expression “if you’ve done nothing wrong you’ve nothing to worry about” is not the answer to legitimate public concern over surveillance. Here are 5 reasons for abandoning the argument once and for all.

videosurveillance.blog.gov.uk

This was another Problem Reaction Solution. People were against cctv cameras in the street, so they let street crime get out of hand to an extent that people are now actualy asking for more surveillance.
They wanted to introduce id years ago but the public said no. So don't stop the boats, actually even go and pick them up, create the Problem wait for the Reaction offer the Solution

 

[Notch7]

People were against cctv cameras in the street, so they let street crime get out of hand

good grief you can find a conspiracy theory to fit anything

how on earth do you get through the day

This was another Problem Reaction Solution

 

[motorbiking]

The Farage lovin numpties on here that are anti ID cards clearly have something to hide…..

Too much cash in hand work praps

Perhaps they worry about how they will recover their.. [everything], if their single mandatory ID is compromised.

 

[IT Minion]

Perhaps they worry about how they will recover their.. [everything], if their single mandatory ID is compromised.

Which is a concern but not unfixable. And as a balance identity theft will be much harder.

 

[carmanmemoranda]

This was another Problem Reaction Solution. People were against cctv cameras in the street, so they let street crime get out of hand to an extent that people are now actualy asking for more surveillance.
They wanted to introduce id years ago but the public said no. So don't stop the boats, actually even go and pick them up, create the Problem wait for the Reaction offer the Solution

That's some twisted logic there

 

[motorbiking]

Which is a concern but not unfixable. And as a balance identity theft will be much harder.

It will be much easier. If you drop the mandatory element, it cannot become the single default ID. It is that, which is the problem.

Simply replace the current National Insurance card with a digital national insurance card and you achieve the same goal, without compromising people's ability to recover from Identity theft.

 

[IT Minion]

It will be much easier. If you drop the mandatory element, it cannot become the single default ID. It is that, which is the problem.

Simply replace the current National Insurance card with a digital national insurance card and you achieve the same goal, without compromising people's ability to recover from Identity theft.

A driving license is the defacto default ID now, which is not mandatory. So there's no change there.

And none of that decides if ID theft is easier or harder. No one has said this would be the exclusive form of ID either. The luddites will probably be able to use their physical driving licences for another decade or so.

National insurance numbers aren't suitable as a unique ID and they aren't even a particularly good starting point.They're designed for a different purpose and with different requirements. By the time you'd enhanced and rebuilt national insurance numbers to include photo ID you've just reinvented the same thing all over again.

 

[motorbiking]

A driving license is the defacto default ID now, which is not mandatory. So there's no change there.

And none of that decides if ID theft is easier or harder. No one has said this would be the exclusive form of ID either. The luddites will probably be able to use their physical driving licences for another decade or so.

National insurance numbers aren't suitable as a unique ID and they aren't even a particularly good starting point.They're designed for a different purpose and with different requirements. By the time you'd enhanced and rebuilt national insurance numbers to include photo ID you've just reinvented the same thing all over again.

The bit you are struggling with, is once something is mandatory, it becomes the default ID, replacing all others.

if you recall the argued use case is - right to work proof. So replacing NI cards with digital NI solved that, assuming you belief there is even a problem to solve, that the cash economy cannot get around.

 

[IT Minion]

I am not struggling with that at all, if the digital ID is made universal then it will inevitably replace all other government photo ID.

The digital ID has been suggested as being mandatory to work, but that doesn't make it universal as, for example, most of the people ranting about it are retired and wouldn't need it. And if it isny universal then it doesn't replace all the other forms of ID. And yes, in that form it is uplifting NI numbers, where you don't even need to keep the card at the moment let alone show it, to being a form of ID with integral authentication as they'll be able to prove you're the person associated with the ID.

Right now that has to be done in two forms, the NI number and the proof of identity in the form of driving licence, passport etc. etc. etc.

 

[IT Minion]

Just for fun I've set up my account. It took a while as I had to set up a new authentication app as I've changed phone, which meany I had to verify my ID which involved my driving licence, verifying personal details, a live face scan and two factor authentication.

Ive also linked my driving licence to the app, but right now that's only for information and doesn't replace my physical ID.

 

[motorbiking]

I am not struggling with that at all, if the digital ID is made universal then it will inevitably replace all other government photo ID.

It's mandatory, so it will become the universal default ID. Its the obvious roadmap for the platform.

The digital ID has been suggested as being mandatory to work, but that doesn't make it universal as most of the people ranting about it are retired and wouldn't need it.

but they would be given it - its mandatory. I don't think there is evidence it's only old people against it. remember- all political parties are opposed except Labour.

And if it isny universal then it doesn't replace all the other forms of ID. And yes, in that form it is uplifting NI numbers, where you don't even need to keep the card at the moment let alone show it, to being a form of ID with integral authentication as they'll be able to prove you're the person associated with the ID.

Right now that has to be done in two forms, the NI number and the proof of identity.

sounds like the use case isn't there

 

[IT Minion]

It's mandatory, so it will become the universal default ID. Its the obvious roadmap for the platform.

but they would be given it - its mandatory. I don't think there is evidence it's only old people against it. remember- all political parties are opposed except Labour.

sounds like the use case isn't there

The use case is obvious.

For government purposes you need one way to prove who you are. Typically that's driving licence or passport. This is what's called Authentication.

You then need to know for that person what they're allowed to do. eg. View or update your Driving licence, veterans ID, right to work, OAP buss pass, universal credit etc. etc. In IT security this is the authorization stage.

If you have more than one form government services that you can interact with online then the idea you wouldn't share the same authentication method between them is madness. That's twice the systems to secure and maintain. Twice the potential for a security breach, twice the credentials to maintain. A shared authentication provider with different authorization based on who you are and the connected services.

Again, if you have any form of digital/online ID that can be trusted by someone then this is the only logical path forwards.