Can I check if a powerflush was done with my new boiler inst

[slant]

I have just had my boiler condemned by a corgi engineer who was sent out via my home assist policy. We then agreed on a price to replace and fit the boiler(independently from the boiler plan company) and to have a powerflush done. He arrived today at 9 and at 1230 i popped out for 45 minutes. When i returned he was gone and the missus said he was finished and when asked confirmed he had done the power flush.

I felt suspicious as in the past this has taken a day and a half not 4 1/2 hours, even though he had an assistant. I also did not up till 12h30 notice any high pressure compression/pump noise while i was working in the living room. i then bled 2 radiators & there was a thin blackish liquid which made the bowl a dirty colour. Is this a sign my radiators have not been powerflushed at all and can i check or send the water off to fernox or sentinel to check TDS content and or if an inhibitor/ chemical was ever added. I will call CORGI on monday. Prudent to note i did call him and challenge him and he is in fact returning monday to add 2 radiator temp/controls he told the missus where not necessary. any advice much appreciated

 

[gasandoilman]

I think you asked and answered your question yourself

 

[simond]

It's nothing to do with CORGI.

They look after gas safety issues in the UK. Even if you could get them to test the water they could only ask the installer to make amends, they can't force them -only if it is a safety issue.

You possibly have a trading standards issue.

You have also exposed a typical misunderstanding of the word powerflush.

We lose quotes all the time against those that can powerflush, take the old boiler off the wall, fit the new one, TRVs wiring etc all in one day.

The customer will say we lost the quote because the spec was the same and we charged more. We were going to take two days, and the Powerflush was going to be through each individual rad as per good practice.

Buyer beware. You will have a job proving the work was not done properly.

PS: By the sound of it they did not follow this procedure.

 

[slant]

Thanks guys.

As far as procedure goes, i was under impression that a powerflush (not just a flush/descale) was a requirement (manufacturers?) before a new boiler was installed in order to validate the warranty should the boiler fail. In my immediate opinion i did not receive the services that i was told id get for my 2K and Indeed this may be a trading standards issue should the technician still say he has done a powerflush, hence my query about proving the work was not done by having the water tested for TDS and for the chemical agents used (inhibitor).

I was only going to ask CORGI advice on what i should do or am i waisting my time there?

thanks again.

 

[giblets]

Not too sure if you are saying that the whole boiler change has been completed or just the "powerflush".

I think you will find that the manufactuers only require a system clean in accordance with BS7593:1992 not a powerflush. The Benchmark log book supplied with the boiler should be filled out by the installer to show, amongst other things, the cleaner used & the inhibitor used.

 

[slant]

Thanks Giblets.

The whole boiler was replaced.
Ive just checked the benchmark(didn't know about this thnx) and under system cleaner it says x400 and under inhibitor it says x100. What does that mean?

Also if cleaner & inhibitor where used should i still have blackish stuff coming out the rads when bled. Ive put this dirty water in a jar and the black sooty stuff has now settled at the bottom of the jar.

 

[giblets]

X400 is a Sentinel cleaner and X100 is their inhibitor. If you pop into your local merchant (Plumb Center or whoever) they will have/can get a Sentinel Testing Kit which allows you to check the concentration of inhibitor in the system. By the sound of it he only carried out a poor quality clean and not a powerflush.

Mind you it's very easy to write X400 & X100 on the Benchmark book.

Are you also saying that he did the whole boiler change in 4.5 hrs?

Lets hope you get an Installation Certificate from CORGI as well.

 

[tryitandsee]

It's all down to trust, do you trust this chap. Did you trust him when he came to your house and condemned your existing boiler. Was he looking for work when he condemned it? Why did you not get a quotation from someone else.

In my opinion, you did not know the chap or have any recommendations from others and you left him on his own for what ever amount of time. God only knows what he has done.

For the amount of time he was there, I should think he could only have attached a portable container (contains chemicals) with auxiliary pump attached, then attached temporary hoses to 'cut off' flow and return pipes and pumped sludge remover round whilst fixing new boiler to wall.
'This they call power flushing' and charge £250.
It all sounds good but in reality it's a bloody good money spinner.

Don't worry to much about it, as long as he bench marks the boiler and you get the guarantee from the manufacturer, it should be ok. He will have to state on the form what measures he has taken for flushing and what chemicals he has used, true or not. Next time take the time off to make sure your getting what you pay for. Even if you loose a days holiday. That was not meant to sound patronizing and apolgise if it does!

 

[Agile]

Guess what?

I bet you have paid him with cash !

Employ a cowboy and you get a cowboy job!

Of course the water is black because it has not been even flushed and certainly not power flushed!

X400 needs FOUR weeks to operate not just 1/2 hour.

You employed a cowboy and you got a cowboy job!

He is probably NOT registered with CORGI to work on his own! I expect you have no idea who he is, first name, mobile number? You cannot take him to court if you dont know who he is ! Email or post his CORGI number and ID card number which he wrote on the Benchmark and I will check it for you.

DONT pay him ANY money until you have the blue Certificate posted to you from CORGI. He is legally unable to provide that if he is not registered in his OWN name!

Tony

 

[tryitandsee]

Good point from Agile about holding payment until certificate arrives.

 

[Agile]

Home Assist probably do employ service agents and if he is personally registered then its quite legal for him to do work for you directly ( as long as he does it properly ).

However, he may well work as an employee of a firm who subcontracts to Home assist. In that case he might not be registered to work on his own.

Of course if you just pay cash and dont have any idea who this fellow is and no proper receipt with a name and address then you have only your self to blame.

Also be aware that the price you have paid sounds quite high depending on what was done for you. We can supply and fit a reliable 24 kW combi for just £1500 ! Someone on Ebay offers it for £970 !

Tony

 

[slant]

Thanks for the reply. Just to state the facts. He has been around once before to fix a previous problem. He is CORGI registered. I have his mobile number CORGI number and have checked him out before hand. He was sent by a reputed company that i have my boiler plan with. He seemed trustworthy and upfront. I actually requested a different technician from my insurance company as i had a reoccuring fault and this guy seemed to know more than the last registered tech. I had the fire dept around twice as the boiler caught fire. He came back to service and found the problem hence condemned boiler. I spent a whole day getting quotes but have a very young child and needed hot water quick, he was the 2nd cheapest but could do the job the following day.Yes we did a deal as he undercut my boiler plan company.
I tend to do my research and hence my issue now that my previous experience of power flushing does not match this one and certainly the fact that the i have dirty rads seemed to indicate this, i am not a trades person so that is why i have sought the advice of professionals on this forum, which by the way on all my previous posts have been very helpful and have allowed me to solve the problem by getting solid advice, so thank you all.

 

[slant]

Sorry forgot 1 more thing. Agile i checked about sentinel x400 and their website say that it needs to be in the system for a minimum of 2 hours and up to 4 weeks but can be left in for longer without damaging the system, just thought that may helpful to anyone reading this.

 

[Agile]

Does his CORGI number decode to him as an individual or to his employer?

I hope you understand the difference!

If you email or post his CORGI number then I can check it for you.

I think that you have been taken advantage of, both in terms of price and in respect of power flushing. He seems to be a cowboy !

What make and model of boiler has he fitted?

Tony

 

[Softus]

Who wrote this:

Only cowboys will say that power flushing is not essential without seeing the condition of the water.

All I would say is that if anyone says that then you should ask if they will give you a written unconditional guarantee against any problems arising from dirt in the system!

Power flushing is a major part of the installation process and the price should reflect it.



And who wrote this:

Power flushing to me is primarily a show for the customer. There are few situations I see it doing any better that the correct treatment left for the appropriate time using the system boiler and pump or in extreme cases mains water pressure flushing.