Correct way to fll out a benchmark?

[darkart]

When filling out the benchmark for newly installed system boilers does every box need to be filled out.

Someone mentioned that the paragraph where it is asking for water temperatures at the taps cold and hot using a flow cup only needs be completed if a combi boiler is being fitted.

If a system boiler is being fitted using a cylinder tank then you would get the flow of hot water to all taps and you would not need to check the flow rate for hot water.

Or is it just good practice to still do these checks and complete the full benchmark?

Was wondering if anyone knows a site on the web that can give more details on how the benchmark should be filled out correctly, thanks in advance

 

[Paul Barker]

That section only relevant to combi.

Where gas pressure asked for certain boilers not applicable just gas rate them if you can find engineering mode (not always published in MI's) if it's a combi run all the taps to gas rate it in hot water mode, that's the best you can do. If not just state boiler sorts itself out as per what information you can glean from MI's or phone call centre for advice.. the questions should be set by manufacturer and be boiler specific. It is pure lazyness to just throw in a largely antiquated standard form, which is largely ignored (evidenced almost everywhere we go, if customer has any kind of paperwork at all seldom is a benchmark completed.

Were it more specifically designed it might earn respect .

Not dising you, but is a poor reflection on the people who passed you for these appliances that you have found yourself asking here how to complete Benchmark. Do the questions set need to also be more relevant?

 

[ChrisR]

Being "passed" for the appliance is about gas safety, not this silly form though.
Surely you just put X300 or X400 in one box, X100 in another, 80º, 70º, 5º, look up the HW flow rate and knock 0.2l/min off it, add the temp rise they give in the book, less a bit.
Then tick all the boxes which ought to be ticked.
Then the other 20 seconds finding the boiler serial number.

Care Only Re Gas Instructions, isn't it?

 

[darkart]

Its not a poor reflection on who passed me just different people have different ideas on what should or should not be entered onto the bench mark and since you don't fully explain what should be entered i also put you into that category.

I notice you don't mention using a flow cup to determine the water flow rate in your post lol oops.

Maybe asking how the benchmark should be filled out was over the top, what i am trying to find out is how acroos the board which paragraphs should be and not be completed when fitting different types of heating fits.

Such as: Combi system or a full condensing system?

What i was after in my question was an overall balanced reply after all not filling out the benchmark can void the warranty on the boiler fitted.

 

[gas4you]

On the boiler benchmark log you only fill in flow rates and temps etc for a combi.

You cannot always fill all the boxes depending upon the boiler being fitted. ie zero rated govenor cannot give burner pressure. This is why the gas rate box is there for you to fill in. Even with the gas rate, it is not always possible to do this unless like the vaillants I fit you can set the boiler to run on full power long enough to take an accurate reading.

Usually you will need a flow cup and electronic thermometer for the hot water side. You can also use a differential thermometer across the cold inlet and hot outlet on a combi.

Again with Vaillant all the required info for benchmark can be obtained via the diagnostic display, except co/co2 ratio.

The co/co2 ratio can always be filled in.

The flushing side of it I always stick the small portion of the x400/x100 tab on here

The question you ask about the flow rate and temp from a hot water cylinder would be tested and filled in on the cylinder benchmark log. This will want to know the hot water temp at the nearest hot tap, head of pressure etc etc.

I hope this has helped

 

[mehran]

i have come to the conclusion that if in the MI it does not ask you to check x y or z in the boilers commissioning then i am not going to put it in the benchmark. as simple as that i am sick of filling in the fecking thing

i have never heard of a maker refusing to do a repair on a boiler because the benchmark was not filled it

if they want me to start filling it in all part of it again then they going to ask me exactly what they want me to check and not give me some standardized bull **** form

i sure all the other installer will call me but i have better to do than form filling

 

[gas4you]

Ideal are now being awkward about benchmark, often won't book a service call without refering to it

 

[mehran]

well lucky i dont fit ideal then

if a maker uses the fact that a benchmark has not been filled in to get out of a repair then that just reflex on how poor they are as a company.

 

[htgeng]

well lucky i dont fit ideal then

if a maker uses the fact that a benchmark has not been filled in to get out of a repair then that just reflex on how poor they are as a company.

I would disagree. In my mind completing the benchmark shows a level of workmanship. It also proves that the boiler was installed by a Corgi approved person.

I am always wary when I see a blank benchmark and it usually means there are several defects with the installation. A recent example of this was an Ideal boiler with a defective flue, undersized gas pipe and no scale inhibitor for the combi DHW.

 

[Paul Barker]

since you don't fully explain what should be entered i also put you into that category.

I'm not your teacher or examiner, if I were I wouldn't be able to do so in a short answer to an internet question and you wouldn't have asked these questions after my teaching.

I notice you don't mention using a flow cup to determine the water flow rate in your post lol oops.

Went without saying. A certain amount of intelligence is assumed, I might have been wrong in that assumption.

Such as: Combi system or a full condensing system

I think if you need to ask this you should retrain.

 

[mehran]

it not the case of not putting anything in but some the questions are just silly,
like asking to gas rate a boiler when all the MI asks for is the burner pressure

btw most MI don't ask for a scale reducer in fact some like alpha say it has a 6 year anti scale guarantee.

but if did fit scale reducer i be more then happy to fire it in the benchmark, but if the MI don't ask me to check the flow or return temp then i not going to do it.

 

[Paul Barker]

We don't have a scale problem with combis round here. I bought a batch of 10 combimates and have been hopeless at selling them.

Whether a scale reducer is fitted is no indication of the quality of installation, it is a reflection of specific water conditions in that area, and if a non scientifically evaluated and proven method is used it demonstrates the installer was either ignorant or a conman, neither of whom would I want in my home.

I do believe it is important to check gas rate aswell as burner pressure when boiler allows as this confirms the boiler is functioning right and fitted with correct jet. However in some instances we are not provided with the necessary utilities within the boiler, even should they be available they are held a secret by the manufacturers. Flow rate and temperature rise of combi is of course a useful alternative guide. Whenever servicing one it is essential to confirm this performance and demonstrate to the client how the boiler is working to the published spec. thus avoiding call backs later as the public are fond of using non scientific methods of evaluating their hot water performance, not noticing the changing environment.

Lat week I had a whole host of enquiries as to why their heating wasn't able to heat the house as usual. "Because your pretty column rads are undersized and it is colder this week than it has been for a long time"

 

[mehran]

i mostly agree with what you said but if the maker hides or does not tell you the info i take it as they don't want it to be done. and checking the hot water flow is a must as it cover your back site when the inlet temp drops.

i not saying not fill it in i just think it should be boiler specific.

like heatline want
inlet
burner pressure high/low(or co2 % for A rated)
hot water flow
delta T over the cold temp

in the town i live in a scale reducer is not really for the combi but for the kettle and to stop stalic tights from growing from the taps

 

[ChrisR]

With Mehran on this. If the Boiler mfr specifies what they want, ok, but reliance on the Benchmark form is almost meaningless. If it's blank it does mean the installer's daft, but if it has numbers on it , all it proves is that he can read.
Asking for flow and return temps without specifying conditions is meaningless. It would be perfectly correct to put 6º for both, if the boiler had only just been switched on.

Information provided by someone who isn't going to be traced, in whose interest it might be to lie about it, is worthless.

Ariston said they wouldn't come to a boiler which was in gtee period, if I couldn't find a Benchmark, by the way. It took very little verbal leverage to get them out to it though.

 

[gas4you]

it not the case of not putting anything in but some the questions are just silly,
like asking to gas rate a boiler when all the MI asks for is the burner pressure.

I disagree with this point, benchmark has box for gas rate!

M I's always state the gas rate in their tech area.

Burner pressure can be perfect and gas rate can still be out!

Refering to your alphas, I believe that they always quote gas rate on boiler, especially older 240/280e!

btw most MI don't ask for a scale reducer in fact some like alpha say it has a 6 year anti scale guarantee. .

Agree, Vaillants I fit come with 5 year anti scale warranty. All other combis I used to fit would have a 'combiguard' fitted as standard practice. Customer didn't get a choice.

Water round here is ridiculously hard

I am of the opinion that if no benchmark filled in then either a 'lazy' installer or c*** job. Personal pride in job crops up again! But hey hoe each to his own