Fitting oak treads to my stairs?

[Muzza80]

Hello,
I've recently bought an attic flat. I have a small hall just in the front door, then a staircase up to the flat with a larger hall at the top that all the rooms come off.

Everything is currently carpeted and I've bought engineered wood boards that I'd like to lay in both halls to replace the carpets, the floor underneath is concrete. I was originally thinking of laying the engineered board on the stairs too but it's going to be quite a bit of expense involved what with all the flooring, stair nosing etc. I'm not entirely sure it would look that good anyway as I'd probably have to lose my bullnose on the treads leaving a square profile staircase with not very deep treads.

I've been thinking about it and come up with a possible solution that I think MAY work but you may be able to help me with anything I've missed.

Esentially just cladding the existing staircase with new oak treads...

If I trim off the existing bullnose from the cheap timber treads Is it possible to get new oak treads (that match the engineered flooring as much as possible) with a bullnose and fit these over the existing treads? I'd also cut and fit new risers in ply or something at the same time and just paint them white leaving just the treads in oak then finish them to match the satin laquered engineered boards at the top and bottom of the stairs?

I'd need 14 oak treads at about 90cm length, 25(ish)cm depth and say 1 inch thick... would obviously need to have a bullnose finish on one side... do you think this would be hugely expensive to get from a timber merchant?

Seems pretty straight forward but I may be missing something completely?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Richard C]

Seems pretty straight forward but I may be missing something completely?

A possible fly in the ointment is the Building Regulations for private stairways; they must have a maximum rise of 220mm and a minimum going of 220mm with a maximum pitch of 42°. When lining the staircase you should ensure it still meets these requirements.

http://www.stairs-direct.co.uk/#/staircase-regulations/4535777769

 

[Muzza80]

Not a problem, the rise will be same as will depth of tread.

So... anyone think this is a doable option?

Would a timber yard be able to put a bullnose finish on timber I order?

 

[ladylola]

Doable, with care.
The new nosing will most likely be a planted on strip as machining the whole tread out of a single piece would be very expensive for no real gain.
You will need to be careful with the fitting to avoid unsightly gaps against the strings.
Talking of the strings have you considered covering these too? Agreed time consuming and fiddley but you would end up with a complete oak staircase.

 

[Muzza80]

Doable, with care.
The new nosing will most likely be a planted on strip as machining the whole tread out of a single piece would be very expensive for no real gain.
You will need to be careful with the fitting to avoid unsightly gaps against the strings.
Talking of the strings have you considered covering these too? Agreed time consuming and fiddley but you would end up with a complete oak staircase.

Thanks for the reply.

I like the idea of just the oak tread with the white riser and strings plus this will obviously cost FAR less! It's a new flat and pretty modern inside, I don't think a full oak staircase would look right along with the oak engineered flooring it would be too much.

With regards to the treads.. so you think it would be best to do each tread from 2 pieces of timber? Would it be best to have them tongue & grooved on one side for fitting them together with the outermostn part having the bullnose?

That would make sense, the full width boards would likely be very expensive as you say!?

 

[ladylola]

Assuming your treads are around 250mm then for the cost factor using smaller boards is a sound idea.
You could use say two boards of around 118mm finished size and t&g together (giving 236mm) and then the nosing could be made out of say 40mm stuff to give a 15mm rebate on the back edge with a overhang og 25mm . Depth of rebate the other way to suit your new treads and to lip over the new white risers.
Don't take these measurements as gospel of course , you'll need to measure up your stairs and it may be a good idea to have them slightly over sized to allow for fitting.

 

[Muzza80]

Thanks again.

Why have the nosing seperate from the 2 boards on the tread?

I was thinking if the tread is 250mm (including existing bullnose overhang) having 2 x 125mm boards with T&G on one side of each and one of them with the bullnose front too? Does that make sense? I assume a woodshop would be able to do this?

With regards to the riser I guess I'd fit the treads first then just cut some ply to the exact size, slide it in, tack/glue it in then paint?

 

[ladylola]

Having the nosing seperate allows it to be rebated which lips over the riser (fitted first) to give a neater appearance and allieviates the need for excessive machining of the tread.
Also it will allow you to use thinner timbers for the treads. For example if the treads are reduced in thickness to 12mm then a nosing that is say 30mm thick with a rebate in the back will give an impression of thicker threads overall.
Hope this is all clear.

 

[Muzza80]

Having the nosing seperate allows it to be rebated which lips over the riser (fitted first) to give a neater appearance and allieviates the need for excessive machining of the tread.
Also it will allow you to use thinner timbers for the treads. For example if the treads are reduced in thickness to 12mm then a nosing that is say 30mm thick with a rebate in the back will give an impression of thicker threads overall.
Hope this is all clear.

Now I see what you mean, yeah, thanks.

I'm looking to do this myself, the one board for the whole tread seemed like it would be much simpler to do but obviously cost is a factor with the wider boards. The other reason for not laying the engineered boards that I already have is that everywhere I've seen these stair nosings they are incredibly expensive!

I'd have to have a tounge & groove machined into the tread boards anyway, would it it work out that much more expensive to have the bullnose done at the same time?

With regards to neatness, if the riser was carefully cut and fitted after the tread boards were then it should fit perfectly, I could afford to make a few mistakes and re-do them too as it would just be cheap construction ply I'd use as it would be painted anyway?

I was thinking maybe these at 1" thick for the treads, 2.4m length for £15 ish seems a bargain, maybe even get them to do the tounge/groove/bullnose for me?

http://www.realoakfloors.co.uk/european_oak_hardwood_timber.php

Failing that I presume any woodshop could machine them for me for not a huge amount of money?

What you think?

 

[ladylola]

To be honest you could do away with the t&g joint, biscuits or even for that matter a butted and glued joint would be more than adequate as the new tread would be supported by the exsisting tread underneath.
The price of the boards doesn't seem too bad and as you are doing it yourself you could even make the nosings too, you just need something like this
http://www.axminster.co.uk/category-Ovolo-and-Rounding-Over-Cutters-207683.htm
Hope I didn't offend when I mentioned about being careful, I wasn't insinuating that you weren't capable. Fitting the riser first then the tread and then the next riser and so and so will be simpler. Fitting the risers afterwards means fitting into a space than is fixed on all four sides, fitting prior to the tread allows more play.
Good luck which ever way you choose to go.

 

[Muzza80]

To be honest you could do away with the t&g joint, biscuits or even for that matter a butted and glued joint would be more than adequate as the new tread would be supported by the exsisting tread underneath.
The price of the boards doesn't seem too bad and as you are doing it yourself you could even make the nosings too, you just need something like this
http://www.axminster.co.uk/category-Ovolo-and-Rounding-Over-Cutters-207683.htm
Hope I didn't offend when I mentioned about being careful, I wasn't insinuating that you weren't capable. Fitting the riser first then the tread and then the next riser and so and so will be simpler. Fitting the risers afterwards means fitting into a space than is fixed on all four sides, fitting prior to the tread allows more play.
Good luck which ever way you choose to go.

Of course not, i'm extremely grateful for the advice!

How would one go about using one of those nosing cutters though? Is the part placed within a router??

 

[ladylola]

How would one go about using one of those nosing cutters though? Is the part placed within a router??

Simple really. Clamp your timber to a bench and if you use the last cutter shown in the link the bearing guides the cutter, all you have to do in effect is hold the router firmly down and move it along the workpiece. The bearing type has the advantage of being consistant, easy to use and is capable of cutting circular work such as the bottom tread that commonly wraps round the newel at the bottom. The non bearing cutter needs the fence to be fitted to the router but it's cheaper and if you leave it set up all your treads will be the same.