Hi, I have two vertical sections of my patio (0.5x3m + 1.5x5m) that I am fitting 38x19 western red cedar (finished on 3 sides) battens to. I've done the framework (47x47 treated timber) and I have the battens ready to go (still trying from application of UV protector). Battens will be spaced 2mm running horizontally. How can I fit them so that the fixings are not visible? I thought to screw them from the upper or lower sides on angle into the framework using something like 3.5x or 4.0x screws of length 40-50mm. Alternatively, even buy a £20 nail gun and use 30-35mm brad nails, quicker but perhaps not as secure. Help?
Fixing 38x19 battens without visible fixings?
- Thread starter mgchg
- Start date
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If you use nails or screws ensure they are stainless steel or brass. Anything else will react with the oils in the cedar and cause black staining which will ruin your timber - even if the fixings are hidden.
I have done a similar thing to this to build a horizontal cedar fence where hidden fixings were required. I fixed through the top of each batten diagonally into the vertical supports using stainless steel screws (3.5x50mm would be fine). Exactly what you suggested. I then fixed the ends and every metre vertically down into the row below to prevent them bowing out as if the boards are perfectly vertical then water will run down and collect in the joints causing saturation until it can dry out (oil/protector won't last forever and cannot easily be reapplied past the face). If fixing vertically like that remember to use a temporary spacer to prevent the gap closing up. The fence has been up for two seasons now and is still as good now as it was when first errected.
By using the screws diagonally and allowing the heads to protrude by 2mm more than the required gap you can use a hammer to bed the next row onto the screw heads to prevent the 'panel' flexing.
Cedar is a very soft wood so don't use a nail gun on it unless it has impact protection unless you want lots of unsightly dents all over your timber. You'll struggle to find suitable brads anyway so better to stick with screws.
Are you planning to align or stagger the horizontal joints? If staggered and joints don't fall on the frame then remember to diagonally screw the end of each pair together to prevent them sliding past eash other.
I have done a similar thing to this to build a horizontal cedar fence where hidden fixings were required. I fixed through the top of each batten diagonally into the vertical supports using stainless steel screws (3.5x50mm would be fine). Exactly what you suggested. I then fixed the ends and every metre vertically down into the row below to prevent them bowing out as if the boards are perfectly vertical then water will run down and collect in the joints causing saturation until it can dry out (oil/protector won't last forever and cannot easily be reapplied past the face). If fixing vertically like that remember to use a temporary spacer to prevent the gap closing up. The fence has been up for two seasons now and is still as good now as it was when first errected.
By using the screws diagonally and allowing the heads to protrude by 2mm more than the required gap you can use a hammer to bed the next row onto the screw heads to prevent the 'panel' flexing.
Cedar is a very soft wood so don't use a nail gun on it unless it has impact protection unless you want lots of unsightly dents all over your timber. You'll struggle to find suitable brads anyway so better to stick with screws.
Are you planning to align or stagger the horizontal joints? If staggered and joints don't fall on the frame then remember to diagonally screw the end of each pair together to prevent them sliding past eash other.
Thank you, that is detailed and comprehensive advice.
I have some 2mm spacing material to use a temporary spacer.
I have built the framework so that the ends of each batten can be secured into vertically run treated timber beams. Good tip on securing mid way across the battens to reduce bowing. Had not thought of it and will do it.
I am going alternate the horizontal joins, e.g. for the 5.4m section, rows alternate between (2.44 + 2.44 + 0.52) and (0.52 + 2.44 + 2.44) -- this means my frame has vertical beams at 0.52, 2.44, 2.96 ... plus some intermediate breams (I built the frame onto an existing fence), but might put more in.
Have just treated the battens with Osmo UV protector plus, so hope will keep them in good shape for some time.
Your reply is much appreciated!
I have some 2mm spacing material to use a temporary spacer.
I have built the framework so that the ends of each batten can be secured into vertically run treated timber beams. Good tip on securing mid way across the battens to reduce bowing. Had not thought of it and will do it.
I am going alternate the horizontal joins, e.g. for the 5.4m section, rows alternate between (2.44 + 2.44 + 0.52) and (0.52 + 2.44 + 2.44) -- this means my frame has vertical beams at 0.52, 2.44, 2.96 ... plus some intermediate breams (I built the frame onto an existing fence), but might put more in.
Have just treated the battens with Osmo UV protector plus, so hope will keep them in good shape for some time.
Your reply is much appreciated!
I'd have been inclined to fix the cedar to the batterns first by screwing from the back and then fixing the whole thing up and hiding the fixings with pellets.
For a truely invisible fixing try a keyhole slot , either just into the timber or with a metal plate.
For a truely invisible fixing try a keyhole slot , either just into the timber or with a metal plate.
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what did you pay for those screws and where did you get them from ? I know whenever I buy stuff for cedar it's expensive !
ebay. 500 x 3.5x50mm a4 marine grade stainless steel, £20.95 (at least in November, ... who knows what they cost now given inflation ...)
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