Fixing heavy radiator to very old plastered walls

[Lynnos]

Hi,
I have been renovating a 1900 victorian tenement flat. I removed a very old radiator from the wall and purchased a nice new one. The walls are brick and plaster (the old type with horse hair!). It is horrible stuff and crumbles away very easily. I had all the walls skimmed to give them an even smooth finish. My plumber attempted to fit the radiator to the wall last night but as soon as we attached it to the brackets the brackets started pulling away from the wall, ruining some of my nice new plaster work.

What should I do? It has left a hole about the size of a 10p coin. My plumber has said we will need to get panels fitted to the wall first to then screw the radiator into this. I am not sure he used long enough screws in the first place but either way there is nowhere else for him to drill into as he has ruined this part of the wall.

Please help, I need to hang it this weekend!!

Lynn

 

[dude_diy]

I am not sure he used long enough screws in the first place but either way there is nowhere else for him to drill into as he has ruined this part of the wall.

You say the walls are plaster then brick??....if you use a long enough screw or bolt with the right size wall fixing you should be able to pick up on the brick and attach to that. Just make sure the screws you get still fit through the rad wall bracket. Personally wouldn't worry too much about the hole...just fill it as it will be hidden by the rad when hung.

 

[Lynnos]

[You say the walls are plaster then brick??....quote]

Hi there, thanks for that. I just dont think a screw will grip now that the holes is the size it is. I can't go any higher or lower with it. What do you think about attaching wooden batons to the wall first and securing 6 points on each to then attach radiator to that?

The problem is some parts of the wall are bossed (i think that is the correct terminology) and if you hit a spot that is bossed it just crumbles.
I did't want to say to my plumber that the screws weren't long enough cause he said those are the ones he uses all the time.

 

[roughcaster]

I'd go along with Dude, the screws need to be longer, but it's the fixing "plugs" that need to be drilled and pushed into the brickwork itself,not just through the plaster. There's a fair bit of weight in a radiator.

Roughcaster.

 

[JohnD]

what you can also do:

drill the hole so it goes at least an inch into solid brick (plaster has no strength). Find some screws that are long enough to reach to the bottom of this hole. Round-headed are better than countersunk. You need at least two screws per bracket, but if the wall is in poor condition you can use three or four.

Hoover or wash out the holes to remove loose dust

Now, fit good big plasplugs in the holes. You may need more than one to reach the bottom of the hole (note that the plug, and the screw, must both be in the brick, not the plaster). I mostly use brown plugs which are stronger than red or yellow but you can also get grey ones in various sizes.

You may find the hole is ragged and the plugs don't fit tightly especially if mortar and bricks are crumbly (here is the clever part)

get a tube of no-more-nails or similar, put the nozzle deep into the hole (so it fills from the end) with no plasplug in it. Squirt until it oozes out at the surface of the hole, withdrawing the nozzle slowly as you fill. Now push the plasplug deep into the hole (it will push out excess no-more-nails) so that it reaches the bottom.

Hint: if the plasplug is recessed below the surface of the plaster, put your long screw a turn or two into the plug so you can push it in. Leave the screw in place for now. You can smooth off the excess no-more-nails flush with the surface of the wall with your filling knife.

Leave it to set overnight. You can now undo the screw, and you will see it leaves a screw-shaped hole that goes down to the plug so you can centre it.

You can now drive your screws through the brackets into the deep plugs.

I only recently heard about the no-more-nails trick, and have found it excellent for screwing into plugs in a difficult wall. it is very cheap and easy. If you have some big washers you can put them under the head of the screw to squash the no-more-nails down and spread the force against the wall as you tighten the screw.

 

[roughcaster]

Good tip that John, worth remembering.

Roughcaster.

 

[Lynnos]

This sounds a little 'make shift' are you sure this would be sufficient?

I hate botch jobs.

Lynn

 

[JohnD]

you are not using the no-more-nails to glue the rad onto the wall.

you are drilling into the brick, and using a long screw and plug so that the brick takes the force.

the no-more-nails just takes up any unevenness or friability in the hole.

I have used it and it is very successful.

A plug which is not a good firm fit in the hole is liable to come loose and pull out, or to refuse to tighten properly, and this trick prevents that problem arising.

 

[roughcaster]

With all due respect Lynnos, you've already got one, (botch job), the radiator pulled the brackets from the wall ruining your new plaster. As stated on here earlier, the fixings (raw plugs) needs to be drilled "well into the brickwork", an inch or more at the very least,+ longer screws and then it will be strong enough to fix the brackets and take the weight of the radiator. It would look a lot nicer doing it that way, than fixing a couple of pieces of timber to the wall as you suggested earlier...... No offence meant here at all.

Roughcaster.