new hardwood windows questions

[jayjay]

Hi there

I've recently had a few quotes for replacement uPVC windows and even though all the companies have tried to put me off wood (basically too expensive) I've like to consider the options. I have one company coming to quote but thought I would investigate ordering the windows direct from the manufacturers and getting a joiner/glazer in to fit them. Answers to any of the following questions would be a great help:

o) irrespective of cost/appeal, what is best - hardwood or uPVC
o) They appear to come in either treated softwood, or hardwood, shoud I go the the hardwood every time?
o) I have existing sash in case, should I replace all the existing woodwork, or fit the new unit into existing woodwork (I guess this depends on the condition of the timber)
o) when ordering, where do I take the measurement from?
o) What's best - lead weighted, or sprung? and will the lead weights be able to cope with sealed double glazed units?
o) I was considering oiling them, rather than painting, is this a good idea?
o) Are they as secure as uPVC?
o) Are they as draft proof as uPVC?
o) Are they straight forward to fit (for a decent joiner)?

Thanks loads
Jayjay

 

[masona]

irrespective of cost/appeal, what is best - hardwood or uPVC

I must admit there too many white PVC windows around and I've just finish oiling with Tung oil on my mum's bay windows and surpising how many people stop to look at it !

They appear to come in either treated softwood, or hardwood, should I go the the hardwood every time?

I would go for hardwood and mostly they are made with mahogany, make sure if you do decide on hardwood, there are 36 difference type of mahogany and some colour can looks cheap, have a look at their wood materials.

I have existing sash in case, should I replace all the existing woodwork, or fit the new unit into existing woodwork (I guess this depends on the condition of the timber)

Depend if you want to replace all the window with the same material

when ordering, where do I take the measurement from?

Best to let them measure up, any mistake will be down to them.

What's best - lead weighted, or sprung? and will the lead weights be able to cope with sealed double glazed units?

Yes, it will cope they now have a twisted bar tensioner

I was considering oiling them, rather than painting, is this a good idea?

Yes, see this. Good point from Oilman.

Are they as secure as uPVC?

Yes.

Are they as draft proof as uPVC?

Yes and the wood is warmer than upvc and don't seem to collect condensation on the frame as you do with upvc if the room is not well ventilated.

Are they straight forward to fit (for a decent joiner)?

They need more care fitting them as you cannot get away with filling in the gaps with filler if not join together or not cut correctly.

 

[jayjay]

Thanks loads for the reply. I am now considering hardwood casement windows - they are a bit cheaper than sash in case and I'm on a ground floor so don't need bottom openers to clean them. The plot thickens, but I'm slowly reaching the conclusion that wood is the way to go (as long as there are fairly good assurances that it's sustainably sourced).

 

[jayjay]

Anybody got any experience of glyngary windows, they are based in Warrington.

Can you recommend a decent joiner that could fit them, I'm in the Ediburgh area

Ta
jayjay

 

[johnegrey]

I'm just in the process of fitting double glazed wooden windows at my property. I ordered them through my local Buildbase who got them from Premdor, http://www.premdor.co.uk

As the openings were not standard (imp or metric) I had them custom made, the timber is pressure treated redwood, 30 year guarantee against rot. I got mine double primed as I'll be painting them to complement the render on my house. A friend who has the same windows has stained his for a 'hardwood' look (unfortunately they are supplied in a pretty fierce orange stain, called 'honey stained' or something)

I'd really recommend this manufacturer based on my experience, the factory fitted glazing units look great, and after I've replaced the furniture with black wrought iron stuff they'll look as good as you can get for the money.

Hope this helps, let me know if you've got any more questions,

cheers,

j

 

[johnegrey]

Check this out for info on wood vs uPVC, and some sources of truely 'green' products,

http://www.greenbuildingstore.co.uk/eco-environ.php

 

[masona]

I'm just in the process of fitting double glazed wooden windows at my property. I ordered them through my local Buildbase who got them from Premdor, http://www.premdor.co.uk

johnegrey,

When the time is right I would like to go back to hardwood windows, do you know how the price of hardwood verus UPVC window is ? Is there a lot of difference in price or do mind telling the price of what you're having done just to give me a ballpark figure. No problem if you don't want to tell us

 

[johnegrey]

Hi Masona,

I had six windows, two whoppers (2.5m x 1.2m), two medium and two small, all double primed, factory fitted lowE glazing, and seperate panes in a 'cottage style' (see their catalogue). The price was around £4K, they come 'ready to fit' with all the necessary furniture, weather sealing etc. The timber is softwood (Redwood), but pressure treated and with a 30 year guarantee.

My Mum had all her windows replaced with custom made oak frames and tradional hand-made leaded lights (it's a 17th century cottage), these look great and are suprisingly draftproof, but you certainly pay a premium for the raw material, which in this case was American White Oak (Quercus alba)

Hope this helps, I know it's a tricky decision as the windows are really the 'eyes' of a house and can affect the whole look, plus they're bloody expensive, mine were the single biggest expense on my whole £35k refirb.

Cheers,

j

j

 

[masona]

Thanks,

To be honest I thought it would be dearer

My next door neighbour just paid £3800 for upvc no lead light just plain boring type 1 front window plus 1 bay window, so your price is quite good, well worth having wood.

 

[johnegrey]

Yes I found this to be the case as well, everyone assumes uPVC is dirt cheap, and there's no doubt that some companies (you know, the ones with the irritating radio ads) are incredibly cheap, this is because their products are crap. If you walk along a street of uPVC'd houses you can clearly tell the good windows from the bad ones, wobbly looking glass, gaps, too much mastic etc all point at cheap installations. Using a reputable company like Everest will get you a great job, but will cost as much (if not more) than a timber equivalent.

My problem with uPVC, apart from the environmental damage it causes in its manufacture and disposal, is that it doesn't age (apart from loosing it's shine); this is why some people love it, it's virtually maintenence free. But for me it's gotta be timber, if you want a more traditional look and/or a natural and sustainable material.

Cheers,

j

 

[masona]

My problem with uPVC, apart from the environmental damage it causes in its manufacture and disposal, is that it doesn't age (apart from loosing it's shine); this is why some people love it, it's virtually maintenence free.

The biggest problem are the pvc door which drop out of square, that's another story !

ive heard that upvc doors have problems closing sometimes especially in the summer time. The plastic expands and stops them from closing? Im not sure if theres any truth to this.

Yes, normally badly fitted and frame slightly out of square.

Also cheap quality window doesn't help as well and what Oilman said here,

No problem with wood, just plane a bit off. Oh, and give it a lick of tung oil of course.

 

[jayjay]

I've made a decision to go for hardwood casement (made to look like a sash in case) custom built. The job will end up a little more expensive than uPVC, but the windows look beautiful (at least in the brochure), check them out at www.glyngary.co.uk. They have been very helpfull and will supply what ever you want (sealed, unsealed, oak, mahogany etc)- you just need to fit them.
Jayjay

 

[JayS]

I couldn't belive PVC was being used in UK for windows and doors when I moved to UK for Sweden. It's quite a nasty material, and when it ages it goes all brittle and falls to bits.

It's nice to see some people are looking at the wood option! It gives the house more character as well.

My parents have got very slow grown redwood window frames, and their house was built 1926. Still the same frames! Now I'd like to see the PVC window that lasts >80 years...

 

[Thermo]

I personally hate upvc, it does age, is hard to clean once it loses its shine. They are certainly no more secure than timber windows, and that is one of the myths that ha s been used to sell them. In my former life as a police officer, i can tell you a burglar will go for a upvc rather than a timber if he wants to get in without removing the glass.

Thermo

 

[masona]

See here and here for more info........