No pre-heat on Hyundai diesel generator?

[RoubaixB]

Hello all, back on DIYnot.com under a new name after a long absence, now happily retired

I bought a Hyundai DHY12500SE diesel generator set. It has no provision to pre-heat the combustion chambers and arrived with rusty water in the chassis tank. Flushing the tank with fresh diesel and replacing the in-line and the main fuel filters brought no improvement; whether self-starting on the green button or cranking with the key it chuffs out white smoke and refuses to start. Eventually after two or three sessions of cranking for up to 30 seconds, which I hate doing, it chugs into life very smokey and eventually runs well. These are the characteristics of a diesel that hasn't been glowed up properly. The distributor is unable to explain why they removed the pre-heater and how it is supposed to start without.

This afternoon a neighbour who is an experienced diesel mechanic tried an old bushman's trick of pointing a propane gas torch into the air inlet and the engine burst into life immediately, which tells us it needs pre-heating.

I suspect I have been sold a tropical model that has been redirected to the UK market to fill the shortage.

Anybody got any pearls of wisdom? The forum never let me down in the past!

 

[bsr]

Return it?
Keep a blowtorch next to it?
Can you retrofit with something like this if there is a cylinder tapping?

GLOW PLUG PRE HEATER CONVERSION KIT 2.25 DIE FOR LAND ROVER SERIES 2, 3 - BR1554 | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for GLOW PLUG PRE HEATER CONVERSION KIT 2.25 DIE FOR LAND ROVER SERIES 2, 3 - BR1554 at the best online prices at eBay! Free delivery for many products.

www.ebay.co.uk

Tbh I didn't think pre heating was a thing any more. I remember glow plugs on really old diesel cars, but anything in the last 20 years doesn't seem to use them any more.

 

[Burnerman]

If this engine has indirect injection then pre heating will be almost vital.....even in warmer times.
Some motors had a flame plug in the inlet manifold, others had one glow plug per cylinder.
Does this motor have either of these, missing or not?
Adaptions into the inlet manifold are possible, into the cylinder head not so - and adding a glow plug may be possible.
If the engine has direct injection then there will be an excess fuel delivery method somewhere......unfortunately just by looking at the engine exterior it’s very difficult to tell.
A compression test on the motor could be a good move, eventually!
John

 

[RoubaixB]

It's brand-new so I doubt there's a lack of compression.

My mechanic neighbour poured some diesel additive into the tank and yesterday for the first time the engine chugged into life on the second attempt. I'm loathe to admit it but I'm thinking of buying an additive for water-contaminated diesel, knowing I'll be ripped off. Going to try adding some isopropyl alcohol to some contaminated diesel first to see what that does.

 

[Burnerman]

Brand new with a rusty fuel tank?
Anyway, I guess the genny is either a twin or a triple direct injection diesel. If it’s indirect injection with some sort of heater then the ignition switch may have two spring loaded positions.
Do replace the fuel filter(s), avoid using ether spray or propane gas to get it running!
John

 

[RoubaixB]

It's a twin-cylinder and the key has only two positions; on and crank. There's no pre-heater and the supplier couldn't explain to me how the thing is supposed to start without.

It also has a self-start option where you press a green button and this has started it successfully now on the second attempt, twice, but it still chugs white smoke and struggles into life with difficulty.

Local generator specialist says: "We don't touch Hyundai generators, they're crap!" so it looks like I made a bad choice.

 

[Burnerman]

I’m not sure what you mean regarding the self start option, as against the key?
Anyway, the white smoke is diesel fume that hasn’t reached its combustion temperature.
This is due to:
Low cylinder compression,
Lack of preheating or excess fuel;
Low cranking speed.
I think you need a full manual for this thing.....I can’t comment on Hyundai generators particularly but generally Hyundai products are very good indeed.
I can’t see any diesel additives being successful in the long run.
John

 

[RoubaixB]

Self-start is where you press a small green pad and it goes through the start sequence itself, cranking for about five seconds. It will try that twice before giving up and needing to be cranked with the key. A neighbour of mine tried an old bushman's trick of pointing a gas flame down the manifold while cranking and it burst straight into life, vigorously. The distributor can't explain to me how it's supposed to start without a pre-heat. Of course it runs okay once started, I'm just miffed that it takes such an effort to get the dammed engine running. I have emailed but the seller is ignoring me so next step is my friendly solicitor for a letter.

 

[Burnerman]

Some diesel engines need to crank for a second or two to allow oil pressure to build up before they will start....this is automatic of course, likewise administering excess fuel requirements if this is necessary.
I guess you may have tried this but have you tried switching the ignition on then waiting for say 5 sec before cranking?j
Most diesels still have glowplugs, but often enough it isn’t cold enough for them to be switched on......I presume this motor doesn’t have them?
I still can’t understand why the machine came with water in the fuel tank? If any of this water got as far as the injection pump it will be goosed.
John

 

[RoubaixB]

Thanks for your continued interest!

Yes when doing the self-start routine it waits a few seconds before cranking and I always do as well when using the key start.

There are no glowplug connections on the engine and there's no glow position on the key start or button to push. Nothing is mentioned in the instructions.

I don't think water got into the engine, the in-line filter was dirty, the main filter looked clean and although the fuel in the chassis tank was bright orange I didn't actually see any droplets when I drained it although some brown crap came out. There is rust on the unpainted steel inside the filler. My guess is that it was manufactured in the humidity of China and when it reached coooler climates condensation happened. I know from 35 years exporting industrial perfumes that a little oxidation in a steel drum causes a lot of orange colouration. I dont know why they dont give it a polyethylene tank. Once running it goes well and copes with variations in load as things turn on and off in the house.

Thanks again!

 

[Burnerman]

If the machine doesn’t crank immediately once the green button has been pushed, it must be doing something, surely?
On a diesel car with this function, it’s glowplug preheat time.
I’m also unsure why the machine has both button and key start....
That doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. It would be good to chat to someone with this machine!
Sorry to ramble on but somethings not right somewhere - it’s going to be -6 soon!
John

 

[RoubaixB]

The self-start routine is intended for when you've got the machine connected to the mains so that it self-starts as soon as the power is cut. It starts what sounds like an electric lift pump, which runs for a couple of seconds then stops, I'm not sure what that is because the lift pump is a simple diaphragm running off a camshaft lobe, that sucks fuel up through the in-line filter. Standard stuff in other words.

Anyway I've emailed the seller and they are ignoring me so I'm going to get my solicitor to write to them requesting an engineer visit.

 

[RoubaixB]

Living in the Scottish Highlands we get a lot of power cuts, mostly when old trees fall on lines so I bought a Hyundai diesel genset. Big pile of crap, there's no preheat so it's a nightmare to start, it chuffs white smoke and coughs into life after 30 seconds or more of cranking. Once running it's fine. A diesel engineer friend has looked at it and can find nothing wrong apart from the lack of a preheat. The supplier's technical manager can't explain why it has no preheat so the supplier says there's nothing wrong with it and refuses to send an engineer.

What would you do? I don't know my way around the world of standby generators so can't decide whether to live with it or sell the accursed thing and buy something better.

 

[Stivino]

Is this a big fixed genny or the kind of thing you keep in the shed and bring it out when needed?

 

[scbk]

You said in the other thread it was quite a large genny, 12.5kva, what are you wanting to run off it?

A little honda used with alkalyte petrol from new, or even a large inverter on a vehicle, would probably be enough to run a freezer once or twice a day which is the main thing to worry about