Power Shower, tingling (current?) in pipes.

[bernardgreen]

I'm now pondering whether or not to put a ground spike in and attach cross bonding from the water pipes onto it. That might just do the trick.

It might make it worse and seriously increase the danger. If the bath is in contact with a live conductor and the pipes are not earthed then the shock will be minor ( a tingle ) as the pipes cannot carry current to ground. If you then earth the pipes they will be able to carry current to ground and the tingles will become musch greater and possibly fatal shocks.

In your position I would bond the hot and cold pipes together and extend that bond to the bonding tag on the bath. This will bring bath and pipes to the same potential ( equipotential ) and remove the possibility of a shock from bath to pipe.

but that might cause other problems elsewhere in the house.

If the bath is in contact with a live conductor and there is no bonding of pipes to protective earth then the new bond will extend that false live into all the pipe work in the house. You would then get tingles or more dangerous shocks from other taps. So you need to find the source of the voltage difference that is causing the tingle.

 

[JohnD]

have you agreed to stop using the shower yet?

 

[AngelV]

If the bath is in contact with a live conductor and there is no bonding of pipes to protective earth then the new bond will extend that false live into all the pipe work in the house. You would then get tingles or more dangerous shocks from other taps. So you need to find the source of the voltage difference that is causing the tingle.

The bath, I don't think, is in contact with any electrical wires - the only wires in the room are those to the ceiling light and it's pull and the isolator ceiling pull for the shower and now the shower. The bath panel was not taken off for the installation so I cannot say 100%, but it is unlikely that there are wires that far into the room under the bath as the bath looks about a thousand years old and there is nothing electric at that side of the room (well there is now, but nothing before shower)

have you agreed to stop using the shower yet?

Not using it at the moment.

 

[radioredcat]

Looking at the circuit diagram of this there are 2 RFI caps L-E N-E so this could be the source of the current so it looks to me that there's an earthing problem.

Page 6 of the document.

http://www.tritonshowers.co.uk/media/11859/as2000xt_thermostatic_ips.pdf

I would hate to think what would happen if the L-E cap went short circuit under these circumstances so you would not get me in that shower.

Please note i am not a qualified electrician but i know enough to say that shower is not safe because under no circumstances should you get a tingle off any pipes.

Andy

 

[xr4x4]

you still havent told us what shower/pump you have.

if i was in your position and it was a std shower pump with a less than 13amps draw, i would cut the cable from the pull cord isolator, wire it in to a appropriate fused plug and plug this into a portable plug in RCD.

also i would check that the mains stopcock was bonded/connected to an earth wire which lead back to the CU, as well as the gas and or oil supply.

i would take a picture of the CU and put the picture up here.

i would also check in the loft/airing cupboard/under the bath to make sure no wires where touching any pipes or anything else obvious was amiss.

 

[AngelV]

you still havent told us what shower/pump you have.

Triton AS2000XT.

Well I am still waiting for plumber to appear to fix.
Meanwhile I've been chatting to Building Control at local council - he was most helpful

But that still does not fix my earth issues.

So - if you are a qualified electrician and live in Hertfordshire (SG postcode area) and are looking for a challenge...

Yes I know you cannot certify someone else's work, but there is a good chance that the whole house needs attention (I will be more than happy with a re-wire) so this will, I guess, cover all bases.

 

[bernardgreen]

also i would check that the mains stopcock was bonded/connected to an earth wire which lead back to the CU, as well as the gas and or oil supply.

Using the term "earth wire" is confusing as the "earth" in the CU is in reality at the same potential as the incoming neutral ( unless it is a TT supply with an effective earth rod ). The "earth" in the CU may not be at the same potential as ground.

In this case if the bath is grounded and the pipes "earthed" then the bath and pipes can and may be at different potentials. Hence the tingle. The bath might be grounded via a metal waste pipe connecting directly into a metal soil pipe.

As the voltage difference that is creating the tingle is between bath and pipe work then it is common sense to bond the bath to pipes so whatever happens elsewhere there cannot be a voltage difference between bath and pipes that can be reached while the person is in or touching the bath.

 

[AngelV]

Just in case you were worried, I am still alive

 

[Taylortwocities]

Did you get it fixed? What was the problem?

 

[MattChan]

The plumbing...
The hot and cold to shower are taken from the hot and cold to sink

From looking at the data sheet:

http://www.tritonshowers.co.uk/media/11859/as2000xt_thermostatic_ips.pdf

Shouldn't there be a dedicated cold feed direct from the cistern and a hot feed tee'd off the cylinder output near to the cylinder? If someone else opens the sink taps while you are in the shower it will suck in air and if they only open the cold tap you will suck in air and hot water, no amount of thermostatic control in the shower would stop that from burning you!

 

[AngelV]

Hi,

He has not been to fix it yet!!!! (an that has prompted me to text him again)

I am using the shower (I know I am playing russian roulette but the tingling is less if I am not in the full jets!)

I got my multimeter out (and of course I have no idea how to use it...) but the only path the current takes is through me when the water runs on me and I touch a pipe.
I tried to 'mimic' me by just having one end of the meter in the shower jet and the other on a pipe, but I got soaked, the bathroom got soaked and because there was water everywhere, the experiment failed.

nusku - its not the water, its the eleccy that is the problem..

 

[xr4x4]

you need to set the multimeter to volts AC, above 250v.

on mine that is - V ~ 600.

you need to put the probes between the shower and the bath, or just try anything to anything.

 

[mikhailfaradayski]

Dear Angel,

I understand that you want to use the shower to avoid being smelly. However, if the next 'little tingle' turns into a 'big bite', you may find that after lying in your bath for a few weeks, the neighbours will probably call the local council to complain about the accrid stench coming from your house.

dirty girl, pooh, you smell

 

[ricicle]

DO NOT USE THE SHOWER OR BATH UNTIL YOU HAVE HAD YOUR ELECTRICAL SYSTEM CHECKED BY A COMPETENT ELECTRICIAN

 

[ricicle]

I am using the shower (I know I am playing russian roulette but the tingling is less if I am not in the full jets!)

I got my multimeter out (and of course I have no idea how to use it...) but the only path the current takes is through me when the water runs on me and I touch a pipe.
I tried to 'mimic' me by just having one end of the meter in the shower jet and the other on a pipe, but I got soaked, the bathroom got soaked and because there was water everywhere, the experiment failed.

..

Does anyone else smell a troll ?