Supply & Fit Replacement Consumer Units - Reasonable?

[David1983]

Hi,

We moved into our house 3 months ago and the wiring into the consumer units (domestic & storage heating - no gas in the area!) looks like a nest of wires. There also aren't RCDs on either of the CUs, what's on each CB in the domestic CU is very random and we'll need 10-way boards anyway as we're getting an extension done in the future.

I've been quoted the following and I'd be grateful for your thoughts if this is a reasonable quote. I live in the Hebrides and sparkies are few and far between...

Material:
- 2x 10Way Hager Distribution Board @ £168.00 (incl. appropriate MCBs)
- 3 mtr 50x50 Trunking @ £12.46
- Hager Board Blanks @ £2.00
- Wiring Center @ £8.58
- 5mtrs 2.5mm T&E @ £5.90
- 5mtrs 1.5mm T&E @ £4.37
- 4mtrs 25mm Brown & Blue Meter Tails @ £36.00

Total @ £237.31

Labour:
- Install containment & wiring Center @ £30.00
- Remove & replace 2x distribution board @ £150.00
- Full inspection & test of installation @ £75.00

Total @ £255.00
Fuel @ £15.00

Total for all: £507.31

Thanks, David

 

[Chri5]

VAT?

What about smoke detection?

Have ou asked if that is absolutely all in, or will he ask for more £££s if the testing reveals issues.

What about the 10mm bonding earths for water and gas, 16mm MET to cu feeds?

Have you discussed circuit position on boards, which rcd will control what circuits. Have you or he discussed rcbo's on direct rail for things like freezers, alarms, smokes. Stuff you don't want failing when a light pops and drops the rcd.

Price seems reasonable, but I would suggest you firm up the exact scope and what will happen if future work post testing is suddenly required.

 

[JohnW2]

As Chri5 has implied, the quote (which sounds pretty reasonable to me) is literally just for replacing the two CUs. How confident are you (or the electrician) that no other work (to wiring and/or other parts of installation) will be required as a result of the 'full inspection and test of the installation'? How old is the installation, and have any recent inspections/tests of the electrical installation been undertaken?

Kind Regards, John.

 

[David1983]

Hi Chris & John, thank you for your replies, here goes....

The price quoted is inclusive of VAT and the earth bonding will be to water only (already existing) as we don't have gas over in the Hebrides. We had a new meter installed in April along with new wiring from meter to CUs so we will be re-using it. We don't have main smoke detection as the house is 100+ years old and I have no idea how old the existing electrical installation is or when it was last checked which is why I'd like it fully checked.

We have discussed which CB will do which circuit and how they will be positioned if that's what you mean but not which RCB will control which circuits - I hadn't even thought of this and was going to leave it to him to use his professional judgement. I will ask him now though, thank you!

The price quoted includes work required to rectify any problems unless they're major dramas, which I think is only fair.

Thanks again, David

 

[JohnW2]

We had a new meter installed in April along with new wiring from meter to CUs so we will be re-using it.

He is quoting £36 for replacing those 'meter tails' (wiring from meter to CUs).

... the house is 100+ years old and I have no idea how old the existing electrical installation is or when it was last checked which is why I'd like it fully checked. ... The price quoted includes work required to rectify any problems unless they're major dramas, which I think is only fair.

'Only fair', yes, but that is the issue that Chri5 and myself were concerned about. If, as sounds to be the case, you are not aware of any recent inspection/testing (and, given the age of the house, it's possible that the electrical installation is quite old), it would really make sense to have inspection/testing done before commissioning the CU change - since, at worse, you could be advised that a complete re-wire (or, at least, substantial work) would be needed in order that the post-CU-change testing would yield satisfactory results.

Kind Regards, John.

 

[David1983]

Hi again John, thank you once again! I forgot to mention that, on the quote, the last 4 items (wiring center to meter wiring) are marked 'if required'. The meter wiring all depends where Scottish Hydro move the meter to as we can't get two 10-way boards in with the meter where it currently is.

I hadn't thought of having the wiring checked prior to the new CUs going in but I'll ask, I understand that the previous owner's uncle fully refurbished the house about 10 years ago (previous owner is our next door neighbour!).

We were wanting the CUs changed for ones with RCDs for safety anyway and we thought we'd get 10-way replacements to allow for our future planned work.

Thank you once again for your help!

 

[JohnW2]

I hadn't thought of having the wiring checked prior to the new CUs going in but I'll ask, .... We were wanting the CUs changed for ones with RCDs for safety anyway and we thought we'd get 10-way replacements to allow for our future planned work.

I really do think that it probably makes sense to have inspection/testing undertaken prior to the CU change. It could possibly reveal major problems, which require major work, and you don't really want to find that out during the testing after the CU change. There is also the possibility that there are problems which would need to be rectified before an RCD would 'tolerate' the situation - another good reason for 'testing first'. As you say, the thing to do is discuss this with your electrician.

Kind Regards, John.

 

[sparkybird]

I don't think £75 to fully test and inspect 2 consumer units (how many circuits on each?) is in any way sufficient. I know it's cheaper up there, but come on!

As others have said - get the test and inspect done BEFORE any work - that way you'll know what you're dealing with. Otherwise you could be left with a big bill for remedial works...

 

[Sherbertlion]

Give the guy a break!

The price looks very reasonable, and about right if there are no major remedials to be carried out.

If we lived in the ideal world then yes, every CU change would have the testing and inspection carried out in advance and everything would be made perfect before the new CU's were fitted! But in reality, not many customers will pay for a full EICR, and the cost of remedials for a perfect installation, then a CU change.

The electrician is very up front with his costs and appears to be giving correct advice/info. from what the OP has said.

Even if testing while changing the boards brings up some hideous defects then,

a) the customer and electrician appear to have agreed these will need to be sorted, and

b) at least all the other satisfactory circuits will have the added RCD protection and peace of mind of testing while the hideously dangerous circuit that may trip the new RCD can be left de-energised or temporarily on an unprotected way until remedied ( )!


And I'm not sure what smokes has got to do with a CU change, always nice to offer it for sure, but certainly not a requirement of changing CU and obviously not included in the prices from the OP.

I'm sure it won't be too hard to check the electricians credentials if there aren't many around.

Go for it!

 

[JohnW2]

Give the guy a break!...If we lived in the ideal world then yes, every CU change would have the testing and inspection carried out in advance and everything would be made perfect before the new CU's were fitted! But in reality, not many customers will pay for a full EICR, and the cost of remedials for a perfect installation, then a CU change.

I never actually said anything about 'a full EICR' - I suggested that the OP discussed the matter of pre-CU-change inspection/testing with the electrician. As I hinted, the most important thing is to detect a situation which might mean that a full rewire, or something approaching it, might be required. That's not impossible with an installation which could be 50+ years old, and just a little bit of inspection and a few tests might well be enough to indicate that was the case.

What one really wants to avoid is a situation in which the CU is changed and the subsequent inspection and/or dead tests then indicate that, 'unexpectedly', the installation cannot (or should not!) be energised for at least several days until major work is undertaken.

...and, no, I am not, never have been and never will be an electrician, so I'm not just 'touting for EICRs'!!

Kind Regards, John.

 

[RF Lighting]

Looks good to me.

I&T is easy while you're doing a board change.

Ze while the tails are out.
End to ends as you connect each circuit.
IR once the board connected up before you power up
R1+R2 link the live tail to the earth bar
RCDs with the board cover off.

Takes about 30 mins on top of the board change.

I never bother with an EICR before a board change.

A few rudimentary checks is all that's required. You can normally tell which installation is going to give you bother and which isn't within about 5 mins.

 

[Chri5]

Give the guy a break!
And I'm not sure what smokes has got to do with a CU change, always nice to offer it for sure, but certainly not a requirement of changing CU and obviously not included in the prices from the OP.

The OP mentioned a new extension, and with 20 circuit ways I had imagined that the extension work would be via the Scots system warrant and the Scots BCO.

So smokes are likely as part of the extension build, so why not plan them in as the OP appears to be doing for other new circuits via the extension build.

 

[David1983]

Thank you all for your thoughts and I didn't mean to cause an argument! I am planning for the extension (actually it's the conversion of the 26'x13' outbuilding that's attached to the living room wall!) when I get the CUs put in but haven't had plans drawn up yet - got to sell other house before we can proceed.

I am now getting the whole house checked before the installation goes it - sparky agrees with your logic however, if any major defects are found it will cost extra to fix them - I think that's fair enough.

The sparky works for a local NICEIC contractor and is fully qualified and is known to me personally.

Thank you once again!