Water Transfer Pump Questions

[amigo]

Thanks nozzle. The problem that I have is that the water is currently blocked due to concrete and is standing outside next to the property foundations.

So should I:

• Setup a pump which directly pumps out the water from the outside OR
• Drill some weep holes in the foundation stone's mortar to allow the water to seep back into the property and then a pump on the inside takes the water out?

Also there was originally blue clay and rubble, which has now been taken out, so what do I fill it back with? Concrete, clay or soil?

 

[Nozzle]

Don't go drilling any holes in your wall. The aim is to create a more permeable area amongst the less permeable clay. Water drains into the more permeable section and you pump that out. You won't be draining the entire water table through your pump in a single effort, as it takes weeks or months to seep through. Though what you would be doing is allowing somewhere else for surface water to go. Look up french drain. Have the drain drain into a chamber in which your sump pump sits

Nozzle

 

[bernardgreen]

All the ground is clay and the more deeper the ground, the more blue solid clay appears and the water just sits there for many days, until the next rain.

Once again, pumping the water from outside the house might lower the water table to a level below the floor of the room. But it might not. You may have to pump out hundreds of gallons of water before there is any significant drop in the level. The water could be coming from a very large area of underground water that is laying on top of the impervious layer of clay.

Drill some weep holes in the foundation stone's mortar to allow the water to seep back into the property and then a pump on the inside takes the water out?

You already have, by accident, the weep holes, if there were no weep holes there would be no water in the room.

Also there was originally blue clay and rubble, which has now been taken out,

When was this basement room created ? Is it a recent "addition" to the building created by digging out that blue clay and rubble ?

 

[amigo]

Thanks for your replies.

Nozzle - Forgive me ignorance, but I'm not exactly sure how you mean that I french drain at the bottom of the trench, but please take a look at the pictures below...is this what you mean by french drain???

bernardgreen - The basement is original, since the house was built, which is around 1930 or earlier. There is no recent addition. The trench has been dug to investigate the cause of water entering the basement - nothing more.

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but I don't think it's water table. I think it's simply surface/rain water which has over years create a natural channel at the side of the house and has then found an entry point through the missing foundation stones mortar. The reason is because the builder had to extract the original standing water and he did this using one of them "water transfer drill pumps" and he managed to extract the trench water within less than 5 minutes and after that there was no more water until the next heavy rain.

Have a look at these diagrams....Does this idea make any sense? If not, what would you do?

View media item 100901View media item 100903

 

[Ian H]

I know a lot of pub cellars have Grundfos KP 360 pumps.

If you have an open franchise you could try a cheaper pump on there and see if it works. If it does you could make a perforated plastic chambe and surround it in stone. The pump could suspend off a rope to let you maintain it.


Have you dye tested all your drains?

 

[amigo]

Hi Ian.

Yes, all drains were dye tested - no issues found.

When you say have a pump, do you mean inside the basement or outside?

Also since the hard blue clay has been taken out and I'm worried about any future structural problems, what can I safely replace it with? Concrete, clay or soil or something else?

 

[Ian H]

I was meaning outside.

I'd fill the bottom of the trench with something that would let the water travel to the pump and backfill ontop with whatever you dug out.

 

[amigo]

I was meaning outside.

I'd fill the bottom of the trench with something that would let the water travel to the pump and backfill ontop with whatever you dug out.

Right. That's very helpful, thanks. If you take a look at the 2 diagrams in my previous post, would the method of concreting and a channel of gravel work?

Also doesn't the ground need to be compressed with heavy clay against the foundations on the outside to stop movement of the footing stones?

 

[Ian H]

Yes, I'd say that would be ok then your pump could sit in a chamber at the end of it.

Can't say about the foundations but I'm sure someone will.

 

[amigo]

Thanks Ian. Really appreciate yours and everyone else's help.

You say the pump could sit in a chamber, but since I'll have weep holes (As the diagram shows) which would allow the water to enter into the basement, would it not be better to have a sump pump on the inside to collect and redirect the water back into a drain? This would also mean easier maintenance and access.

Have a look at the plan below and let me know what you think:

View media item 100910

 

[Nozzle]

A french drain is a perforated pipe buried in gravel. The pipe has perforations only on one side so if you face them up, the intention is that surrounding water perforates into the gravel and then into the pipe where it runs into the chamber and is pumped away. If you fit the perforated pipe with the holes facing down, the aim is to drain the water FROM the pipe into the surrounding gravel. When I constructed one, I also wrapped the perforated pipe in geotextile to help prevent silt getting in. Worst that might happen is fluid drains through more slowly. No problem, I didn't want to "drain" any foundation area too quickly, as that might heave or sag the ground

Nozzle

 

[amigo]

Thanks nozzle. Please take a look at the diagrams I've posted earlier. Just so that I can make sense of it, how would your perforated pipe help with such a setup?

 

[just pumps]

I know a lot of pub cellars have Grundfos KP 360 pumps.

If you have an open franchise you could try a cheaper pump on there and see if it works. If it does you could make a perforated plastic chambe and surround it in stone. The pump could suspend off a rope to let you maintain it.


Have you dye tested all your drains?

Small chain rather than rope is better. Sink a chamber in to the floor, rest the pump on something like three bricks that way the pump only gets fed water not crud. The KP range from Grundfos are good pumps and would think the 250 would suit but as always check the MI`s first.

 

[amigo]

Small chain rather than rope is better. Sink a chamber in to the floor, rest the pump on something like three bricks that way the pump only gets fed water not crud. The KP range from Grundfos are good pumps and would think the 250 would suit but as always check the MI`s first.

Just pumps - Is there a possibility of an example diagram, just so that I can make sense of what your describing? It's just that I've seen many examples of indoor sum pump systems, but never an outdoor version...especially the style and type you describe.

 

[just pumps]

There was plenty in that link showing pumps in a container below ground level, the principle is the same inside or out.
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&r...-jung.co.uk/&usg=AOvVaw1-kbpC843jNMiM4E1ddERf

These people aren`t cheap but use quality pumps and are experienced.