What Causes a Fuse to 'Blow'?

[stillp]

I've come across a few of them, and they're not to BS1362, they're cheap knock offs, usually there's no silica in them

Yep, more counterfeit Chinese garbage. I'm generally not at all in favor of excessive regulation and believe in free and open trade across borders, but when it comes to China I'd happily see a complete ban on the importation of everything from that country until it actually manages to do something about (a) the general quality problem, (b) the dangerous products which have emerged from time to time, and (c) the amount of counterfeits. Unfortunately, as our governments (both British & American) seem to have sold out to keep the masses happy with ridiculously cheap goods, it's unlikely to happen.

It couldn't happen now, as we've all become dependent on them for so much of our manufacturing.
Have a look at http://www.counterfeit-kills.co.uk/blog2/?p=14
Counterfeits are only part of the problem though. An even bigger problem in our industry is copies that do not carry the name of a major western manufacturer, but carry a name and/or part number that is close enough to that of a respectable manufacturer to fool some people. Often they will have copied the dimensions of all the components, but in the wrong materials and to the wrong tolerances.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I'm generally not at all in favor of excessive regulation and believe in free and open trade across borders, but when it comes to China I'd happily see a complete ban on the importation of everything from that country until it actually manages to do something about (a) the general quality problem, (b) the dangerous products which have emerged from time to time, and (c) the amount of counterfeits. Unfortunately, as our governments (both British & American) seem to have sold out to keep the masses happy with ridiculously cheap goods, it's unlikely to happen.

Will you therefore lobby your elected representatives against the TTIP, which will be used by your industries to foist dangerous products onto us?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

It couldn't happen now, as we've all become dependent on them for so much of our manufacturing.

Of course it could.

Make the "manufacturers" who outsource to <anywhere> responsible, under pain of eye-watering sanctions, for the quality. Ditto people who sell, or facilitate the selling, of the goods.

If directors of companies faced personal financial ruin, and personal incarceration for significant periods, then trust me - they would suddenly find that they were able to be a lot more diligent.

 

[stillp]

Who would be the regulators/enforcers BAN?
I was BTW responding to PBC suggestion of an embargo on Chinese goods, and I was pointing out that such action would hurt the reputable manufacturers as well.

 

[PBC_1966]

Will you therefore lobby your elected representatives against the TTIP, which will be used by your industries to foist dangerous products onto us?

There might be worrying aspects of it in many ways, but how would that agreement in itself prevent the dangerous junk from China being imported to either the U.K. or the U.S.A?

Who would be the regulators/enforcers BAN?
I was BTW responding to PBC suggestion of an embargo on Chinese goods, and I was pointing out that such action would hurt the reputable manufacturers as well.

Given the extremely bad reputation which is now associated with the tag "Made in China," I would like to think a truly reputable manufacturer would get out of China and bring production back to America, Britain, or wherever.

 

[stillp]

No need. There are plenty of reputable manufacturers (including many in the USA) who have outsourced much of their production to China, and maintain management systems that ensure quality and safety are adequate.

 

[PBC_1966]

No need. There are plenty of reputable manufacturers (including many in the USA) who have outsourced much of their production to China, and maintain management systems that ensure quality and safety are adequate.

Maybe there are some, but unfortunately there are other manufacturers once considered very reputable who have moved production to China and quality has suffered immensely. Look at Milwaukee power tools as an example. First they moved production to Mexico and quality started to decrease, then to cheapen production costs further they moved to China and quality plummeted. Back when the tools were made in the U.S.A. Milwaukee had a great reputation for well-made power tools that were durable and long-lasting. Now there's little difference between a Milwaukee drill and any one of the no-name brands from China.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Now there's little difference between a Milwaukee drill and any one of the no-name brands from China.

Chicken and egg (if you don't know the answer is chicken).

Could it be that their sales were falling because people were buying the cheapest?

So, the only way Milwaukee could stay in business was to 'compete' on equal terms.

 

[PBC_1966]

Sad if that's the case, although we could hope for a turn around. I do believe that even many less critical people are finally starting to realize the problems with cheap Chinese goods and understand that if they want decent quality they're going to have to pay more for it. Here, at least, there seems to be sufficient backlash from some quarters that many companies who do still manufacture in the U.S.A. make that fact quite prominent in advertising and on packaging.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Who would be the regulators/enforcers BAN?

The existing regulators/enforcers, funded by allowing them to keep the £millions imposed in fines. We'd probably need to remove any powers which they have to impose fines themselves, and have cases go through the courts, to avoid conflicts of interest.

I was BTW responding to PBC suggestion of an embargo on Chinese goods, and I was pointing out that such action would hurt the reputable manufacturers as well.

It would.

But then again, that might make the reputable manufactures more inclined to lobby their governments to do something about the disreputable ones.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Now there's little difference between a Milwaukee drill and any one of the no-name brands from China.

Apart from having a US company to sue when the drill disintegrates and removes fingers.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Here, at least, there seems to be sufficient backlash from some quarters that many companies who do still manufacture in the U.S.A. make that fact quite prominent in advertising and on packaging.

I knew somebody once who was a senior civil/petrochem engineer, and he got the job of project managing he build of an oil refinery in Canada. The union(s) insisted that all the bits and bobs had to be made in US/Canadian plants employing union labour, and that would be enforced by the people building the refinery refusing to use stuff that did not bear the appropriate union stickers.

They had a lot of stuff made in Mexico etc, and bought the stickers from union leaders.

 

[PBC_1966]

The existing regulators/enforcers, funded by allowing them to keep the £millions imposed in fines. We'd probably need to remove any powers which they have to impose fines themselves, and have cases go through the courts, to avoid conflicts of interest.

Not to mention the long-standing principle in British law that only a court can impose a fine, and that no minor official in some government department can simply decide to impose and collect a fine without the accused party being able to have his day in court.

They had a lot of stuff made in Mexico etc, and bought the stickers from union leaders.

Somewhat sneaky!

With the trend of putting "Made in U.S.A." very prominently on packaging here now to appeal to those specifically looking to buy American-made goods, I've also noticed one or two products adopting what might be regarded as a slightly sneaky approach: A prominent U.S. flag on the box with something like "Proudly designed & engineered in the U.S.A.," but then when you search the small print on the box you'll find "Made in China." You can't say that the big statement on the front is not true, but it's clearly intended to catch out anyone who doesn't stop and think enough about what it actually means - And why they didn't actually just say "Proudly made in the U.S.A." like some other products.

 

[JohnD]

Not to mention the long-standing principle in British law that only a court can impose a fine, and that no minor official in some government department can simply decide to impose and collect a fine without the accused party being able to have his day in court

Like a traffic warden can't give you a parking ticket?

And HMRC can't charge you for sending in your tax return a day late?

But wait....

 

[PBC_1966]

Indeed - There have become more and more instances over the years in which (completely unconstitutional) legislation has provided for it. Originally, to use one of your examples, a traffic warden could give you a parking ticket, but there was still the option to go to court and argue your case. Now with the "decriminalized" parking system, they've perverted that into making the "fine" a civil debt with no real recourse after going through the tribunal process, which is not a court of law. It's wrong and should never have been allowed to happen.

The same sort of thing applies to some specific legislation which (again, completely unconstitutionally) has reversed the burden of proof from the proper position of it being for the prosecution to prove guilt beyond any reasonable doubt to the case where once some official has decided that a person is guilty it's then up to that person to prove his innocence. Again, totally wrong and should never have been allowed to happen.