Wires & sparks

[EFLImpudence]

i mean just something that would simulate what the bulb does to become a load, in other words i want to make an artificial load

Why don't you use a bulb?

so when i make a circuit out of my artificial load i know that it will not spark or heat up the wires. to my understanding the light bulb becomes a load by forcing the current to pass through the thin filament

The bulb doesn't force the electrons through, it restricts their flow so that they are forced though by the pressure behind them (voltage) causing heat.

and then the electrons leave the light bulb and go to negative terminal of the battery without a problem, so is there some demonstration online somewhere where i could simulate this same thing without the actual bulb.

What do you have against bulbs?

if it is true that after the bulb forces the electrons through the filament they go back to the negative terminal without a problem can't i use a little wire or something like that to simulate a filament and use it as my load in the circuit instead.

Yes. It won't take long.

all this is part of a trying to gain a deeper understanding of what makes a load, a load.

Everything is a load.
We are controlling the circuit so that it does what we want.

what is it about passing through the load (the bulb or a motor, etc ) that now lets the electrons go back to the negative side of the battery without heating up the wire now.

It would if it weren't large enough to handle the current.

if the circuit has no load it would just heat up the wire and spark, but if the circuit has a load it would not heat up the wire to the negative terminal.

That is because the load is restricting the flow (and is able to do this without being destroyed) instead of allowing an unrestricted flow of electrons which would destroy the cable.

 

[Cigaro]

A load is characterised by resistance (or inductive reactance, which is a little more complex).

There is a relationship between resistance, voltage and current called ohm's law.

A bulb has a relatively high resistance, which limits the current through it. Your piece of wire has a very low resistance, which causes a large current to flow through it.

Both are "loads". Just that the piece of wire is such a low resistance load that it will heat up and melt, because it will pass more current than it can handle.

I hope you are not playing with mains electricity to learn this stuff.

 

[dhutch]

You can't use a piece of wire instead of a bulb, as that would create a short circuit.

You could use a long piece of wire, say about 1km of 1.5mm² copper, connect it to the battery and see absolutely nothing happen.
How would that help?

Or if you picked the right thickness/lenght combination you could get a halfway house and have a warm wire.... As ultimatly, bar a nice glass capsual of inert gas, all a bulb is made from is coiled up lenght of the right thickness wire!

Obviously if the bridging wire is not thin relative to the supply cables they themselves would start to get hot, at which point assuming they are suitable protected to stop that, the protection (breaker/fuse/etc) will become open circute and isolate the lot.


Daniel

 

[starjayjames123]

thanks for your response. you've answered my question without even knowing it. from what you've said i gather that resistance is what makes the bulb a load. so now i know that a resistor or something which has resistance is exactly what i've been looking for.

you may not believe this but i know alot about current. and i've even wired my house including may outlets and switces and bulbs. i know the practical i just not so strong in the theory. but now that i know that resistance is the missing element that i need to add to my circuit to prevent the sparking and heating of the wire. many tutorials well tell you about a load but they don't tell you what exactly is a load. but now as you've unintentionally taught me, a load is some form of resistance, be it a bulb, a toaster or whatever.


thanks for you answers

 

[ban-all-sheds]

you may not believe this but i know alot about current.

No, I don't believe it.

You don't know a lot about it.

You don't even know the relationship between voltage and current.

and i've even wired my house including may outlets and switces and bulbs.

That's scary.

i know the practical i just not so strong in the theory. but now that i know that resistance is the missing element that i need to add to my circuit to prevent the sparking and heating of the wire.

So with such a lack of basic understanding, how can you do proper circuit design?

How can you understand or know about fault loop resistance?

What testing did you do when you wired your house?

many tutorials well tell you about a load but they don't tell you what exactly is a load. but now as you've unintentionally taught me, a load is some form of resistance, be it a bulb, a toaster or whatever.

Please carry on learning, and stay away from doing house wiring.

 

[starjayjames123]

i guess i did well because my house has been running for almost 8 years. you don't need to know the science behind electricity to under stand how a breaker or an outlet works. half of the architects who draw house plans know nothing about how to build them. they only know theory not practical. well i know the practical of electricity. negative to negative, ground to ground, and positive to positive. cuz i live in a country with dc current.

 

[bernardgreen]

According to several reference sources the Virgin Islands have 110 V 60 Hz supplies

60 Hz is AC, not DC

 

[starjayjames123]

i'm not really from the virgin islands, i'm from st.lucia in the caribbean. my country just wasn't in the list.

my country uses 220 volts dc, very easy to wire


but thanks for your help along the way

 

[EFLImpudence]

http://www.kropla.com/electric2.htm

 

[Monkeh]

my country uses 220 volts dc, very easy to wire

It would very much surprise me if you have DC distribution. And DC is no easier to wire than AC.

 

[bernardgreen]

my country uses 220 volts dc, very easy to wire

It would very much surprise me if you have DC distribution. And DC is no easier to wire than AC.

DC is far more difficult to instal.

Use an AC switch on DC and you the switch can catch fire. Fuses will not blow as there is no over current and RCDs will only operate if the charred remains of the switch (or other burnt structure ) provide a path for earth leakage currents,


For one thing switches designed for AC 220 volts must NOT be used on 220 volt DC. When switch contacts open the current will continue to flow through ionised air in the gap ( the arc ) until the gap is too wide for this to continue or the voltage driving the current is removed.

In AC 50 Hz the voltage drops to zero 100 times a second, the arc stops. A gap of 3mm between contacts is adequate.

In DC the voltage is constant and the arc will continue until the gap is too long for the arc to continue, From memory the minimum gap to ensure the arc collapses is more than 6 mm. Some DC switches use magnets to bend the shape of the arc to make it longer than the gap between contacts.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

my country uses 220 volts dc, very easy to wire

So you don't know what resistance is, which means you don't know how voltage relates to current, you don't have even a basic theoretical knowledge of volts amps and watts that are taught to children here, and you don't even know what type of electricity supply your country has.

You think that to be able to design and install domestic electrical services all you need to know is "negative to negative, ground to ground, and positive to positive".

You have done no testing, and have so little ability to understand failure modes that you adopt the stupid notion that as long as it appears to work it must be OK.

You are an idiot.

 

[Monkeh]

my country uses 220 volts dc, very easy to wire

It would very much surprise me if you have DC distribution. And DC is no easier to wire than AC.

DC is far more difficult to instal.

Use an AC switch on DC and you the switch can catch fire. Fuses will not blow as there is no over current and RCDs will only operate if the charred remains of the switch (or other burnt structure ) provide a path for earth leakage currents,

The arc can easily supply the overcurrent. The RCD will operate in the same conditions as on AC. It's no harder or easier, you just have to use appropriate equipment.

 

[bernardgreen]

The arc can easily supply the overcurrent.

Not in a switch as the load ( lamp or appliance ) is still in series with the arc.

The RCD will operate in the same conditions as on AC.

It has to be the type that operate on DC as AC types use a current transformer that ignores steady state DC

 

[Monkeh]

The arc can easily supply the overcurrent.

Not in a switch as the load ( lamp or appliance ) is still in series with the arc.

The RCD will operate in the same conditions as on AC.

It has to be the type that operate on DC as AC types use a current transformer that ignores steady state DC

A lot of RCDs are now. Valid point on the switch, though. Until it eats through to a neutral (assuming you've got a double pole switch or looped in at the box).

Either way, that doesn't make it harder. Using different parts != more difficult. Wire's the same, theory is the same, ohm's law doesn't change, etc. None of it has anything to do with difficulty, and everything to do with the fact that we don't use DC distribution much.