Margaret Thatcher

[Big_Spark]

There was a TV documentary on Thatcher just the other night. That is where the info came from. The Junta was trying it on, they never thought it would come to war. Britain doesn't even want the Malvinas, it was just a metter of time until we gave them away anyway.


joe

Joe...how can you say the Junta was trying it on..They INVADED a group of Islands they HAVE NO LEGAL CLAIM TO. They KILLED British troops, they Killed two Civilians trying to defend their homes..

And as for the Belgrano..look at the details of the ship..

Laid Down in 1938 as the USS Pennsylvania, a HEAVY Cruiser

Main armament was 8 of 14" rifled barrel high velocity canon with a range of approximately 35,000 yards (about 20miles). They were accurate to 22,000 yards (13.5 miles)

Plus it had a belt of armour around it's hull that was 15" thick and capable of withstanding a 12" shell from 2 miles or an armour piercing round up to 10" from 8 miles

Now in the early 1970's the US Navy refitted the ship with modern anti-aircraft Radar guided systems, Radar Guidance for the Main armament was updraded and modernised. It was also equipped with computerised control systems for Torpedo ranging and firecontrol. Further, it's powerplant systems were overhauled and modernised packs installed, it was capable of sustaining 32 knots for up to 1500 miles...

The US Navy sold it to the Argentinians in the mid to late 1970's when it was renamed General Belgrano.


Now lets think of our sailors out there..all we had were Destroyers and Frigates, we have not had a ship capable of taking on the Belgrano since the 1950's....Had it changed course back toward our ships, some 23 miles from it, it would only have needed to sail at 32 knots for 75 minutes to be in firing range with it's main armaments...

Had a 14" shell hit one of our destroyers or frigates they would have been blown out of the water and sank within minutes. This is not speculation, but a naval fact even acknowledged by the Argentinians.

The scale death incurred was unfortunate, but the death opf the ship was clearly justfiable and necessary. It also meant that the rest of the Argentinian Fleet stayed in Punta Aranus and elswhere for the duration of the conflict. Had they not, a lot more would have died on other vessels on both sides.

War is hell, it is nasty, bloody and has no morals, We did not start the War, they did.

As the old saying goes..."If you play with fire, you get burnt"

 

[Richardp]

Blimey, Richard, down the shed on the bottle? Good job you are 28 miles off shore !

That what I thought, a bit strong wasn't it.

I'm totally lost now!! what is abit strong? read what ever it was again.

 

[empip]

[..............She also transformed this country - her influence is still felt, especially with things like people who were given the opportunity to buy their own properties. .

Um, you are 30? '75 ........ I had my first mortgage at 21 in 1967 .. all my peers were doing similar things ... Plenty of us were mortgage free by 36, bucking the trend at the right time.
Maggot sold off the council houses cheaply, which we had paid full (and some) for from our taxes.
Nearly killed off the unions, but I know one area where a union was probably the best upholder of safety and safe practices .. not all bad stuff by any means.
Govn is a trendy thing .. NL will pass, sooner or later .. Best set up a mess then get out just before the fan is hit ... That has been NL's plan hasn't it?

 

[Richardp]

Well I'm still confused as to what I said that you found so offensive but assume its to do with selling off the council houses, well I can only tell it from my location maybe it worked for you but in the smaller cornish villages the houses have been bought up by londoners as 2nd homes the villages are now dead in the winter, you know all this, well here in scilly where there is limited housing its a catastrophe. sorry thats not good news for you.

 

[empip]

Blimey, Richard, down the shed on the bottle? Good job you are 28 miles off shore !

That what I thought, a bit strong wasn't it.

I'm totally lost now!! what is abit strong? read what ever it was again.

All those ***'s .... Blimey, the buttons were pressed alright ! Clear skies here

 

[masona]

Blimey, Richard, down the shed on the bottle? Good job you are 28 miles off shore !

That what I thought, a bit strong wasn't it.

I'm totally lost now!! what is abit strong? read what ever it was again.

don't want to fall out with you ****

The way I'm reading it, you seem angry with someone here, if so, talk about it without being abusive but please accept my apologies if I read it wrong.

 

[Richardp]

No! everythings good
blimey I, m getting paranoid, better start taking them tablets again

 

[empip]

Crikey I thought that dreaded lump of the Canary Islands had fallen into the drink and Dickie had seen the wave coming ...... You will give us a shout Richard, if the unthinkable happens? I mean, you are riding point so to speak... Tis approaching that time of year..

tsunami -- could be generated by part of a mountain twice the size of Britain's Isle of Man crashing into the sea following an eruption of the Cumbre Vieja volcano on La Palma, in the Canary Islands -- part of the Spanish island chain off West Africa.
Travelling at speeds of up to 500mph, the tsunami would be an unstoppable force and would be the biggest-ever recorded in history........The energy released by the collapse would be equal to the electricity consumption of the entire U.S. in six months.

Tabs .. V's ??

 

[AdamW]

Britain doesn't even want the Malvinas,

Of course we don't there's no such place

 

[Softus]

The Belgrano incident was nothing short of cold blooded murder. A peaceful settlement was on the cards until that moment.

Here's a question - is "claptrap" the sound made by one hand clapping?

 

[markie]

the only good thing about maggie is her daughter , winning I'm a z list get me out of here

 

[Richardp]

Crikey I thought that dreaded lump of the Canary Islands had fallen into the drink and Dickie had seen the wave coming ...... You will give us a shout Richard, if the unthinkable happens? I mean, you are riding point so to speak... Tis approaching that time of year..

tsunami -- could be generated by part of a mountain twice the size of Britain's Isle of Man crashing into the sea following an eruption of the Cumbre Vieja volcano on La Palma, in the Canary Islands -- part of the Spanish island chain off West Africa.
Travelling at speeds of up to 500mph, the tsunami would be an unstoppable force and would be the biggest-ever recorded in history........The energy released by the collapse would be equal to the electricity consumption of the entire U.S. in six months.

they reakon we'd have six hours, the official advice is "sit down, put your head between your knees and kiss your arse goodbye"

 

[empip]

..............
And as for the Belgrano..look at the details of the ship..

Laid Down in 1938 as the USS Pennsylvania, a HEAVY Cruiser

....................

The US Navy sold it to the Argentinians in the mid to late 1970's when it was renamed General Belgrano.

Belgrano was originally USS Phoenix (CL-46) Brooklyn class Light cruiser .. She weren't no Battleship me dear.
Belgrano

This is "Old Falling Apart" The PENNSYLVANIA a Battlewagon survivor of Pearl Harbour, sister ship to Arizona.

'Penny' In the background, lying in dry dock Pearl harbour during and following the attack. The Official Story

HMS Conqueror Brit sub 28knots ( 32mph ) submerged, that means all weather...
Belgrano was a sitting duck to a modernish, nuclear, nato submarine... No real air cover unless that aircraft carrier had ventured forth .. that too would have been blitzed by the sub, twas, apparently, the main potential target...

Blimey, the sub has been the vanguard navy boat for years ... Conqueror used the most cost effective (cheapest) means on the Big B ... 3 standard torps. 66% result.
Conqueror carried, besides even more advanced wire guided torps.. the sub Harpoon missile with something like 130 km range.. We now know how effective similar missiles can be...
Nah, Belgrano was a sitting duck, less than that and the old flat-top Veinticinco de Mayo would have been creaking on the scene.

There will always be controversy over the sinking.. timings relative to peace proposals by third parties etc etc..

have to feel for the guys on the spot.. waiting on politicians sitting in the warmth of home.. Maybe not giving 110% to the task in hand.

 

[Richardp]

good job them japs did it, otherwise the yanks might not of sent big John wayne to save us from the square heads

 

[Thermo]

the belgranos capabilities have already been listed, she could have turned at any time. the entire operation was sea based and therefore she was a huge threat. The old flat top carrier you mention was more than capable of being an effective weapon in delivering its anti shipping aircraft an was a highly mobile threat. The fact that she went to port after the belgrano was sunk showed how effective a message its sinking was. unfortunatly in war decisions have to be made and disectted in the cold light of day. i wonder what people would be saying now if she had been let to run and the british fleet had been even more badly mauled then it was?