Spirotrap Magnabooster?

[JohnD]

I'd go for one, though if you like DIY plumbing you could fit yourself and save £200.

Prevention is better than cure....

 

[craig51]

Amen to that.

Its really simple. Even if you start with a spotless system, with inhibitor, over time sludge will form. The inhibitor has a certain lifespan, and over time the soft water will react with the copper and then sludge will form. Its far better to keep the inhibitor topped up,and install a filter BEFORE any of that happens. No point doing it after damage has been done.

If its too expensive, find someone else who will do it cheaper. You dont need BG to do it for you. I have one on my system and will always have one.

 

[ALEC1]

Hang on a minute, if a sealed system is not being regularly topped up once the water has reacted with the metals, it will react no more, it becomes inert.

FWIW the two systems I have had sludge issues with had filter protection and inhibitor, I am beginning to think that the cold surface on the plate heat exchanger attracts build up...

 

[craig51]

thats interesting (honestly) why do you think the cold surface attracts it?? or causes it? (again honest question)

Your right, if in a perfect world a system is not being topped up, so no new water is entering, then there will be a chemical reaction, it will then stop once all used up. However, wht then happens to the sludge that just formed.It could, find its way into those pesky wee components and **** things up. FOr the sake of £100ish, get it fitted.

 

[ALEC1]

yes I agree with that, I doubt the effectiveness of inhibitor, given that i rarely use it...and dont get issues...


also its the high temperatures and on-off cycles that seem to cause the issues...


much better is lower temperatures and longer pump running time that you get with compensation controls...

 

[JohnD]

the spiro also traps flakes of limescale, beads of solder, builders dust and grit, as well as non-magnetic orange rust particles and black sludge.

even though there shouldn't be any.

 

[ChrisR]

I am beginning to think that the cold surface on the plate heat exchanger attracts build up...

I've told you before that some soluble iron oxides precipitate on the cold surfaces, and I've told you why. This a wonderful discovery you're making now is it?

No filter or magnet will stop those.

also its the high temperatures and on-off cycles that seem to cause the issues...

Evidence or reason please? Or is it just more mistaken unfounded nonsense which happens to suit a particular mantra?

---
Biscuit - sorry to say, BG's record is awful, spoilt by a few bad apples probably. My experience is of a disproportionate number telling the client lies of some sort or another to try to get work or new boilers etc etc.

Last cust coming to me worried - a BG guy had repaired the boiler, but on leavng said she needed a new boiler really because the one she had ( Potty Suprima) could kill her. Left a quote for £3500.
There was nothing wrong with it. I've had a dozen or so like that, and a couple of dozen more in the last few years, without the death bit thrown in.

 

[ALEC1]

chris who are you to tell any one any thing?

I am glad you have thought about this issue too.

The observation about on off cycles and high temperatures is based on experience, I only instal boilers with compensation controls which does change the way the systems behave....you wouldn't know that or have experience because you only install numpty on-off controls You ptrudly told us once, so you have no experience of them..

 

[ALEC1]

In fairness though I undoubtedly read about cold surfaces of plate heat exchangers and the way the attract crud in the combustion chamber, but I can't credit it to you, Chris...

For a long time you were rude and abusive to me and I had you on my ignore list...so your posts were deleted from my screen...

 

[mysteryman]

If you have a properly installed and therefore clean heating system which does not require topping up, you are very unlikely to get sludge in it.

 

[JohnD]

...even though there shouldn't be any.

 

[ChrisR]

chris who are you to tell any one any thing?

I am glad you have thought about this issue too.

I'm a qualified metallurgist and I've investigated the precipitate. What have you done to "think about this issue"?

You were saying only recently that filters and magnets removed anything coming back to the boiler
There has been wide knowledge that's wrong, for years. It's not a secret, & you've been told why more than once.
Now you're

" beginning to think that the cold surface on the plate heat exchanger attracts build up".

Well whoopy doo, smell the coffee.
If you've read elsewhere about the composition of the precipitate I'd like to see a link.

The observation about on off cycles and high temperatures is based on experience, I only instal boilers with compensation controls which does change the way the systems behave....

You know something about what you install, mostly straight out of the brochure. You keep complaning how the manufacturers don't explain much so you don't know much...
It seems you've forgotten about the other 99+% of installations and how they work.

Simply installing a system the way you do does NOT tell you any thing about its life expectancy compared with what it would have been if you'd done it differently. Yet we get repeated assertions. Is this simply self aggrandisement? Unless you've conducted trials you haven't mentioned?
You install XYZ, puff your chest out and tell everyone why it's marvellous because it suits your salesman's ego and self-delusions. It's pretty transparent. We get loads of assertions, most of which don't stand up for a minute to any sort of engineering questions.

you wouldn't know that or have experience because you only install numpty on-off controls You ptrudly told us once, so you have no experience of them..

Excrement.
You asked me a couple of years back how many compensated systems I'd installed or worked on, I replied something like 2-3 dozen. Now it would be a few dozen more.
Also a lot more which aren't controlled like that, for all sorts of reasons.
I've also quizzed a lot of installers covering several thousand installations. While I'm assessing them for their ACS they tend to be cooperative with replies.

On the other hand, your assertions about on-off controls are often way wrong, it seems you don't measure much about what happens with those.
Understandable, because your mantra doesn't rely on evidence. Repugnant none the less.

I've sat a 6 way status/temperature recorder on a laptop, bought for diagnostics, on a few, but there were no big surprises. I daresay others have done the same, but don't hear it from you.

I haven't got you on "ignore" but I do ignore most of your nonsense, and I know I'm not alone.

This thread is typical of where you've introduced your same old stuff. Nobody else did. It wasn't necessary.
You asked about obsessive behaviour. Please think hard.

 

[ALEC1]

Chris I did not know that you were a metallurgist.

Do you put inhibitors in your systems when you install new boilers?

 

[ChrisR]

Satisfy the manufacturer's demands, or no warranty.
X100 usually, without much conviction.

Can be a problem on old systems. Inform customer and get them to agree action - based on practicalities and economics.

Aqueous ferrochemistry is complex, as are inhibitors. I understand enough to write a page or two of A4, which is only scratching the surface.
I did metallurgy then electronics, >engineering in a few process etc industries. "Control" a common thread.

 

[ALEC1]

Yes much like me...although on some I don't put any inhibitor in...and none of them are showing any signs of problems.

I do believe that permanent protection such as a magna booster is a better investment than inhibitors..