VIESSMAN VITODENS 200W(35kW), ATAG E32C or VAILLANT 837 ?
- Thread starter hel273
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Right, to enter in to the clash of the super boiler debate...
I was at viessmann HQ at telford yesterday. Had a look at that 200w boiler and does some fancy stuff with the right controls, if I need a boiler for my house I would be happy to have the 200w.
Out of atag and viessmann i would take the viessmann not because atag are crap but you will be vastly more likely to find an engineer to fix a viessmann then atag
Also all boilers will fail at some point, be it in the first year or 20 years down the line. vissemann have 5 year warrantee on the boiler and 10 years on the heat exchanger so you have some fall back if it goes tits up.
I was at viessmann HQ at telford yesterday. Had a look at that 200w boiler and does some fancy stuff with the right controls, if I need a boiler for my house I would be happy to have the 200w.
Out of atag and viessmann i would take the viessmann not because atag are crap but you will be vastly more likely to find an engineer to fix a viessmann then atag
Also all boilers will fail at some point, be it in the first year or 20 years down the line. vissemann have 5 year warrantee on the boiler and 10 years on the heat exchanger so you have some fall back if it goes tits up.
we haveIf you go for Atag you won't be disappointed. Very high quality. The E series are their entry level boiler. The Q is the top end version which you can include add-ons. I don't think its fair to say Atag and Vaillant in the same sentence. I would say Atag are on par with Viessmann, but I have always preferred Dutch
Btw, If anyone wants a quote for an installed Atag, drop me an email.
S
sanj.varah
Funny you should say that. I tried to get someone out to install my Vitodens 300 and nobody would touch it. All the installation diagrams and the like are in the form of Process and Instrumentation Diagrams which I suspect the average plumber doesn't understand.
Also the Vitodens 300 instructions imply a DIN standard for installation. I checked with building control and you can actually install it to a DIN spec because of some compliance with EOTA (European Organisation for Technical Approvals), this is mentioned in part G of the building controls. This allows an install with an unvented cylinder without the 2 port energizing valve and you also do not have to have the T&P valve or the tundish on the cylinder. It just has to be approved by DIN.
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Well, I would use the word 'obsolete'. Viessmann do not make a 300 series at that output any more. The 200W is an improved version of the 300 series 26 and 35kW.
The Viessmann 100 does not use an aluminium heat exchanger, it is the same Sheffield steel as the 200/300/Vitocrossal series only smaller. There are no problems with the HE in the 100 series, it is the other parts, notably electronics, that have been the issue.
It is made on a budget but then the UK is considered the cheapskate centre of the World by boiler manufacturers for selling low cost stuff.
Blue Angel is a mark awarded in Germany I believe for products which achieve the least environmental impact in their field, not just boilers. Does anyone know more about the Blue Angel?
S
sanj.varah
mmm.. it was the viessmann sales rep that told me the vitodens 100 had a aluminium silicate heat exchagner. shows what he knows.
Blauwe Engel was the top of the line ATAG until it got replaced with the Q series.
not sure on this but the environmental symbol is gruene punkt i think.
Blauwe Engel was the top of the line ATAG until it got replaced with the Q series.
not sure on this but the environmental symbol is gruene punkt i think.
From what I understand when the 100 was first released it did have a aluminum heat exchanger but was soon changed.
Don't know where you got that from. Changing the HE in a boiler is a fundamental design job, we fitted some of the first 100 series in the UK (which it was designed for) and I haven't seen any changes, it was always stainless steel.
They could have done with throwing out the electronics, shame they didn't.
They could have done with throwing out the electronics, shame they didn't.
Er, the price of the VITODENS 200W seems to vary alot (both inclusive of VAT)... £1171 - £1975
http://www.plumbingsupplyservices.co.uk/acatalog/New_Vitodens_200_Range.html
http://www.plumbase.com/product.asp?main=Heating&subcat=HE+Boilers
If an approved installer was supplying the boiler for installation how much roughly can I expect a VITODENS 200W, ATAG E32C or Q38C to cost -or rather be charged (excluding flue/controls/labour etc)
???
http://www.plumbingsupplyservices.co.uk/acatalog/New_Vitodens_200_Range.html
http://www.plumbase.com/product.asp?main=Heating&subcat=HE+Boilers
If an approved installer was supplying the boiler for installation how much roughly can I expect a VITODENS 200W, ATAG E32C or Q38C to cost -or rather be charged (excluding flue/controls/labour etc)
???
S
sanj.varah
add another £200 for the weather compensation and £150 on top of that for the vitotrol room stat.
I would bother buying one unless you got the above as all you will be doing is paying for something that has a lot of potential but not using it.
For some time I have contemplated replacing our Potterton Netaheat 16/22 with a Viessmann 200W or similar but I am unable to find a good reason.
I carry out 99% of all household servicing and repairs but am concerned about modern "high efficiency" systems. During the Potterton's 30 years life I have replaced the relay which failed within a month, two heat exchanger gaskets, and the spark generator. In fact the spark generator had a dry joint which was obvious and could easily have been repaired in minutes.
The present Grundfoss pump, the only replacement is 17 years old and apart from that probably 3 or 4, 2 way motorised valves have failed. The original 30 year old Potterton mechanical time switch has been cleaned and the bearings cleaned and oiled and it is virtually inaudible and totally reliable.
We have a four bed, two bathroom, four living room and kitchen detached house. We cook with gas and we use no other form of heating and being retired the heating is on all day and evening until 11.30 P.M. In the last twelve months our gas bill was just over £600.
We have about three weeks off in the summer.
Would anyone hazard an estimate as to how much money I will save each year with a Viessmann 200w, the likely total cost of an installed Viessmann 200W, also what is a realistic expectation of the life of a modern Viessmann 200w.
With such figures I can do a few calculations in which will be included the loss of 6.9% on the capital tied up in the new equipment.
Only discovered this site today. Regards Malcolm
I carry out 99% of all household servicing and repairs but am concerned about modern "high efficiency" systems. During the Potterton's 30 years life I have replaced the relay which failed within a month, two heat exchanger gaskets, and the spark generator. In fact the spark generator had a dry joint which was obvious and could easily have been repaired in minutes.
The present Grundfoss pump, the only replacement is 17 years old and apart from that probably 3 or 4, 2 way motorised valves have failed. The original 30 year old Potterton mechanical time switch has been cleaned and the bearings cleaned and oiled and it is virtually inaudible and totally reliable.
We have a four bed, two bathroom, four living room and kitchen detached house. We cook with gas and we use no other form of heating and being retired the heating is on all day and evening until 11.30 P.M. In the last twelve months our gas bill was just over £600.
We have about three weeks off in the summer.
Would anyone hazard an estimate as to how much money I will save each year with a Viessmann 200w, the likely total cost of an installed Viessmann 200W, also what is a realistic expectation of the life of a modern Viessmann 200w.
With such figures I can do a few calculations in which will be included the loss of 6.9% on the capital tied up in the new equipment.
Only discovered this site today. Regards Malcolm
I did an energy survey with Brit Gas, they suggested a new condensing boiler and the payback would be 20 years (!) assuming straightline, zero IRR
so I will be keeping my money (if any) tightly tucked away. When the boiler becomes economically irreparable, and i have to get a new one, the improved efficiency will be a bonus.
The returns from £2,500 invested for 10-20 years will I am sure be more than the savings from boiler efficiency.
I got a much better return from loft and cavity wall insulation, and of course pipe and cylinder are well lagged.
You can get your own report from
http://www.britishgas.co.uk//energy-efficiency.html
and
http://energyefficiency.house.co.uk...StfK9M9r8YGzwlGJKgT4JRlX11DpB350qN1!494990936
It will probably take you 10 minutes or so to type in size of house, type of heating and insulation, etc. they also allow for part of country you are in.
You can print your own report, or they may post you one, I didn't get any salesmen pestering me.
Mine said I could save £109 a year with an extra layer of loft insulation, a high efficiency boiler, and turning down my room stat a notch/getting a cleverer programmer. Guess what i didn't do?
(if I put £2,500 in an ISA and earned an average 5% that would be £125 p.a. tax-free. If I invest it in my RCBO sales and bikini-waxing businesses I would hope to earn considerably more, with capital and income growth)
They might send you some free CFL lightbulbs too.
Replace a boiler over 15 years old £2500.00 £83.62 20+ years
Fit low energy light bulbs £55.00 £16.58 3 years
Install up to 250mm of roof insulation £274.00 £6.98 20+ years
Add delay start thermostat £114.00 £3.81 20+ years
so I will be keeping my money (if any) tightly tucked away. When the boiler becomes economically irreparable, and i have to get a new one, the improved efficiency will be a bonus.
The returns from £2,500 invested for 10-20 years will I am sure be more than the savings from boiler efficiency.
I got a much better return from loft and cavity wall insulation, and of course pipe and cylinder are well lagged.
You can get your own report from
http://www.britishgas.co.uk//energy-efficiency.html
and
http://energyefficiency.house.co.uk...StfK9M9r8YGzwlGJKgT4JRlX11DpB350qN1!494990936
It will probably take you 10 minutes or so to type in size of house, type of heating and insulation, etc. they also allow for part of country you are in.
You can print your own report, or they may post you one, I didn't get any salesmen pestering me.
Mine said I could save £109 a year with an extra layer of loft insulation, a high efficiency boiler, and turning down my room stat a notch/getting a cleverer programmer. Guess what i didn't do?
(if I put £2,500 in an ISA and earned an average 5% that would be £125 p.a. tax-free. If I invest it in my RCBO sales and bikini-waxing businesses I would hope to earn considerably more, with capital and income growth)
They might send you some free CFL lightbulbs too.
Replace a boiler over 15 years old £2500.00 £83.62 20+ years
Fit low energy light bulbs £55.00 £16.58 3 years
Install up to 250mm of roof insulation £274.00 £6.98 20+ years
Add delay start thermostat £114.00 £3.81 20+ years
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