Bricking up fireplace prior to gas fire installation

[lasors]

Hello,
We have a hole in the wall where there was a back boiler and fire. We have a flueless, wall mounted gas fire to fit, obviously right on the hole in the breast. The gas supply sits at the back of the hole and will therefore need extending to the front and enter the back of the fire through the concealed aperture.

Is it sensible to get an engineer in to extend the pipe and leave it flopping about in the middle of the hole, and brick up the hole around it? Obviously I can't brick it up first and remove access to the pipe I'm not sure how else to do it,

 

[namsag]

Its a case of getting hold of someone who will fit it first , he will have a look at new fire to see where connection is and then alter pipe and advise you on bricking up.
One of those jobs that needs actually seeing to give proper advice

 

[expertgasman]

I assume from the tone of the OP, that you intend to fit the fire youself??

Don't. But standby for flak and nonsense from the anti fluless brigade

 

[lasors]

No, it'll be fitted by a professional. It's a pain because we'll need him in twice, once to extend the pipe, then I'll brick up the fireplace, then again to fit the fire. 2x call out charges

What nonsense can I expect from the anti-flueless brigade, expertgasman? Do they have a bad reputation? I have, so far, no reason the believe they are any less safe than any other gas fire.

 

[ChrisR]

There's an infamous Cwmbran case of one which came out of the factory with a setting wrong. The installer didn't check it, and the woman and her dog died from CO poisoning.

You have to have a big open vent to fresh air, which people block because they're drafty, and then you're relying on a catalyst to turn CO to CO2. The only way a user can check at all is to have a CO alarm fixed correctly, fairly close to it. With fresh batteries. Always.

So they're a bit of an accident waiting to happen.
I've been to several which would only just stay alight, they were so fussy about sensing the air in the room. So they kept going out...

I wouldn't have, or recommend one, or fit one.

 

[expertgasman]

OK. They are not ny more dangerous than a "normal" fire, and some would say they are safer, based on the stats.

You may find a fitter to fit he fire AND brick up the hole, but it is really a two stage job

You need to find an EXPERIENCED fire fitter. You need to determine the final fixing position, and ensure that the gas pipe exits the wall in such a position that it is concealed after the final fit.

This is bread and butter work. Don't forget the ventilator, and take some care over the positioning to reduce nuisance draughts.

 

[expertgasman]

What make of fire have you purchased?

 

[expertgasman]

There's an infamous Cwmbran case of one which came out of the factory with a setting wrong. The installer didn't check it, and the woman and her dog died from CO poisoning.

This is the only fatality to be ssociated with a FGF. I apologise if the girls family read this, and are upset by this being disussed. 1 tragic fatality is too many. The fitter didn't have registration to fit fires.:
http://www.gas-news.co.uk/archive/storage/pre-10/2009/data/C1/TB_183.pdf

You have to have a big open vent to fresh air, which people block because they're drafty,
100 sq cm. you do have to consider draughts when siting.

and then you're relying on a catalyst to turn CO to CO2. The only way a user can check at all is to have a CO alarm fixed correctly, fairly close to it. [/i]With fresh batteries. Always.

Every CO alarm I've seen states 1M - 3M from appliance. Every gas appliance should be monitored by one IMO

So they're a bit of an accident waiting to happen.
Stats.

I've been to several which would only just stay alight, they were so fussy about sensing the air in the room. So they kept going out...

Probably because the pilot injector was dirty. Why is it a bad thing for it to go out when needing a service?

I wouldn't have, or recommend one, or fit one.[/quote]

So why did you attend several fires, presumably to repair?

 

[lasors]

The fire is a Focalpoint Cheshire.

There will of course be a CO detector fitted nearby.

A vent already exists in the back wall which, from memory, is at least 7"x5", maybe a bit larger. It can't be closed, only bricked up, and I've actively avoided this, decorating around it, for the sole reason of providing adequate ventilation for a gas appliance, even if it does look a bit ugly.

 

[expertgasman]

A vent already exists in the back wall which, from memory, is at least 7"x5", maybe a bit larger. It can't be closed, only bricked up, and I've actively avoided this, decorating around it, for the sole reason of providing adequate ventilation for a gas appliance, even if it does look a bit ugly


Is this a plastic or masonry vent. If it is a terracoota type it is probably not suitable. Get the fitter to check

 

[lasors]

It's louvred masonry. I assume it is the same as a broken one I have removed from an upstairs cupboard, and appears to be made of plaster.

For what reason would it be unsuitable?

EDIT: on the outside it is the terracota, 'waffle' type.

 

[gas_man_gaz]

is there any reason ya didn't want a open flued fire?

 

[lasors]

Well, we wanted gas, not electric, but the breast isn't really big enough to accommodate a traditional hearth and surround. The wall hung ones look very modern, so suit the decor. The Cheshire, including installation, will probably come to £300-ish, which is cheap compared to any hearth/surround that we liked, which is more affordable for us given it's our first house and needs near total renovation. And we do like the style.

We even considered a small DEFRA approved log burner but the regulation hearth size means it would stick out into the room too much, which would look a bit daft.

 

[Homesafe]

There's an infamous Cwmbran case of one which came out of the factory with a setting wrong. The installer didn't check it, and the woman and her dog died from CO poisoning.

You have to have a big open vent to fresh air, which people block because they're drafty, and then you're relying on a catalyst to turn CO to CO2. The only way a user can check at all is to have a CO alarm fixed correctly, fairly close to it. With fresh batteries. Always.

So they're a bit of an accident waiting to happen.
I've been to several which would only just stay alight, they were so fussy about sensing the air in the room. So they kept going out...

I wouldn't have, or recommend one, or fit one.

As always spot on, Chris. The fires themselves can work safely if fitted correctly and vents etc are not blocked but I personally have seen this and thats why I always discourage the use of them.
They are not for primary heating its only a secondary source of heat.

 

[lasors]

It's almost irrelevent that it produces any heat at all. The flame effect would probably be worth it on its own!