Masonry Cream - is it all it's cracked up to be?

[^woody^]

Q-value

+ plants etc.

We are talking about masonry walls not twiggy plants or reactions on the sub-atomic level.

Stop fishing for support of their nonsense claim, or at least refer to something relevant.

 

[bernardgreen]

The mentions of plant reducing wind chill ona wet brick wall is relevant as it referes to the effect that chill chill of a wet wall has on the heat transmission through that wall. I do not have the calculations for wind chill effect on wet brick work that were made back in 1980. They are with the new owner of that house. They were based on actual temperature readings of the surface of a normal external brick wall when wet and subject to wind. That value was then used as the "ambient" value to calculate the heat loss through the wall.

 

[^woody^]

Wind chill is a perception, and it has no effect at all on lowering a material's temperature any lower than ambient air. It's irrelevant to heat loss from buildings.

 

[footprints]

Looking at your original post, my advice would be to get the house re-pointed which will in fact brighten up the brick / stone work no end, as you only have two outside walls (and perhaps a side return on one side at the back) using a thermal paper on the inside will improve comfort at a reasonable cost.

http://www.gowallpaper.co.uk/erfurt-mav-wallrock-thermal-liner.html?gclid=CIKD0P2JxMcCFaIIwwodNwEBtA

The main causes of discomfort in Victorian homes is not the 9" solid walls but losses through the roof and the wonderful "original features" single glazed sash windows and stripped wood floors, there was a reason people had thick curtains, lino, carpet and rugs!

 

[Linda Secker]

Hi all, thanks for your comments

so basically, this fancy new product is not going to be any better than a coat of Thompsons water seal...... in which case, is £1800 value for money?? I'm thinking probably not, I could probably get someone to see to the ropy bits of pointing and give it all a coat of waterseal for half that.....

Thanks guys - you have helped me make my mind up - we'll be dry lining the coldest rooms as we get round to them anyway

L

 

[^woody^]

If you have stone walls, then you need to be careful about the pointing so that it is not too strong. Don't just let anyone work on it, they need to be experienced with stone mortar.

Use a product similar to that I linked to earlier. It lasts much longer than Thompsons.

 

[endecotp]

Wind chill is a perception, and it has no effect at all on lowering a material's temperature any lower than ambient air. It's irrelevant to heat loss from buildings.

Hi Woody,

I'm surprised to see you write that, as you generally seem to know what you're talking about....

Have a look at this: http://www.salford.ac.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0020/142472/094-Rirsch.pdf

They consider both the increased thermal conductivity of damp materials compared to dry, and also the effect of evaporative cooling.

 

[^woody^]

They consider both the increased thermal conductivity of damp materials compared to dry, and also the effect of evaporative cooling.

The authors .....

Dr Eric Rirsch - Safeguard Europe Ltd, Redkiln Close, Horsham, West Sussex, RH13 5QL, UK
"Safeguard Europe Ltd. is a UK-based company specialising in providing damp-proofing and waterproofing solutions for the construction industry

Dr Zhongyi Zhang2 - Advanced Polymer and Composites (APC) Research Group
"APC Research Group has a track record of attracting funding from European Union, DTI, industries and regional government. The projects include .... development of water and moisture repellent coating for building materials... "

Absolutely no bias or vested interest there whatsoever. Be careful what you find on Google.

I normally deal with peer reviewed papers or proper research from independent bodies and not commercial organisations. And that is why I know that there is no miracle waterproofing product to paint on a wall to get 30% energy savings. Why are people spending time and money drilling walls for CWI or fitting EWI, when they can just paint a liquid around the house?

Yes there is a correlation between moisture and heat transfer, but not in the context of the claims made by that company. That's where pseudo-science mumbo jumbo comes into it. Use a bit of plausible sounding science, which does have some basis, apply that to a product in a completely different context, and convince people to buy your product.

 

[joe-90]

It's the inside of the room you should be looking at. Warm moist air from inside the room passes through the inner bricks of the solid wall and condenses within the brick causing damp. It's called interstitial condensation. If you insulate the inner wall you will stop this from happening. What painting the external walls has to do with anything I really can't grasp.

 

[mikeey84]

The authors .....

Dr Eric Rirsch - Safeguard Europe Ltd, Redkiln Close, Horsham, West Sussex, RH13 5QL, UK
"Safeguard Europe Ltd. is a UK-based company specialising in providing damp-proofing and waterproofing solutions for the construction industry

Dr Zhongyi Zhang2 - Advanced Polymer and Composites (APC) Research Group
"APC Research Group has a track record of attracting funding from European Union, DTI, industries and regional government. The projects include .... development of water and moisture repellent coating for building materials... "

Absolutely no bias or vested interest there whatsoever. Be careful what you find on Google.

I normally deal with peer reviewed papers or proper research from independent bodies and not commercial organisations. And that is why I know that there is no miracle waterproofing product to paint on a wall to get 30% energy savings. Why are people spending time and money drilling walls for CWI or fitting EWI, when they can just paint a liquid around the house?

Yes there is a correlation between moisture and heat transfer, but not in the context of the claims made by that company. That's where pseudo-science mumbo jumbo comes into it. Use a bit of plausible sounding science, which does have some basis, apply that to a product in a completely different context, and convince people to buy your product.

The product is terrible, and won't help achieve anywhere near a 30% saving on heat loss, however wind will speed up evaporation, and evaporation will lower the temperature of a wet, heated object, like an uninsulated wall