Albert said:
Firstly, thanks for your reply
I looked very carefully into Part P
First, and most important and fundamental question - is what you have read the Part P Approved Document (which is just guidelines, and has
no legal force), or the actual
law, i.e. Statutory Instrument 2004 No. 3210 The Building (Amendment) (No.3) Regulations 2004?
EICs, MWCs, PIRs, BS7671 compliance etc etc have absolutely nothing to do with Part P
As I understand it Part P makes it clear that BS 7671 is part of the building regulation which electricians should comply with the relevant parts of it (other than BS 7671). I think that there is a link between all those names (NICEIC etc.), BS 7671 and Part P; it is clearly links BS 7671 with part P in 'The requirements part and in section 0.
No - the newly amended Building Regulations do not
require compliance with BS7671. The
only mentions of BS7671 in the Regulations are this paragraph:
"special location" means a location within the limits of the relevant zones specified for a bath, a shower, a swimming or paddling pool or a hot air sauna in the Wiring Regulations, sixteenth edition, published by the Institution of Electrical Engineers and the British Standards Institution as BS 7671: 2001 and incorporating amendments 1 and 2."
and a footnote telling you that you can buy a copy of the Wiring Regulations from the IEE.
Even the Approved Document clearly says that compliance is
a way of meeting the Building Regs requirements, but that is all.
If you feel competent to fill forms in then you can do so, irrespective of what the Building Regulations require in terms of being regarded Competent to self-certify compliance with them.
This is exactly the point being competent is something that you have nothing to feel or decide about, as I see it you have to be qualified otherwise you can't be considered competent.
You may see it that way, but the law does not. There has never been a legal definition of "competence", and please note that nothing that anyone signs on an EIC or related form states that they are in any way "qualified". Of course, 2360/2361/2381 etc etc are
ways of demonstrating competence, but they are not mandated, in exactly the same way that there is no guarantee that someone who is qualified is not incompetent.
If you look in section 0 paragraph 0.8 a. and b. the idea is that a person who is not properly qualified would not have the necessary knowledge of BS 7671, the understanding of electrical installation, testing /inspection and health and safety etc.
That may be their idea, but most people are agreed that it's a pretty discredited one. And as I have pointed out before, and may do so again before I'm finished, you are referring to the Approved Document, not the actual law.
Whether you decide to notify LABC of the work is up to you
The discission whether to notify the authorities is not in your hands,
That's not what I said. I wasn't talking about what you are required to do, I said that whether
you decide to do what you are required to do is up to you. The law
requires me not to exceed 70mph on motorways, but the decision to comply with that law or not is in my hands.
there is a list of jobs that you can do without notifying but you still must be competent, if you are doing DIY work, you should follow the list of work that you allowed to do and than ask a competent person to certify it (no notification or registration required).
Another no, I'm afraid. If the work is notifiable, and you are not Competent to self-certify
compliance with the Building Regulations, then you have to notify the LABC, and it is then their responsibility to determine whether you have
complied with the Building Regulations. I keep stressing that the way that I do, because the issue of compliance is not one of compliance with any particular wiring regulations. Also, as many electrically qualified and competent people bitterly point out, Competence to self-certify
compliance with the Building Regulations has nothing to do with demonstrable competence to perform electrical installation work.
Finally, it seems that many LABCs are attempting to sidestep their responsibilities by saying that if you cannot self-certify
compliance with the Building Regulations then you must get your electrical work inspected, tested and certified as being safe, and compliant with BS7671, by someone competent to do so, despite:
1) There is clearly no legal requirement to adhere to BS7671
2) There is no legal definition of "competent" in this sense
3) What they are then effectively saying is that if
you cannot self-certify
compliance with the Building Regulations they will accept a certificate from
someone else who cannot self-certify
compliance with the Building Regulations.....
It's a farce.