Adding in ceiling PIR, is my diagram correct

[ex_directory]

Did a search around but everyone asks a slightly different question so apologies if this has been answered before...

Wanting to add a ceiling PIR to a room in the house but keep existing wall switch to override the PIR if needed.

Will this diagram work to have either the PIR or switch (or both of course) turn on the lights?

 

[Taylortwocities]

Yes, that would work. But I'll bet you'll get annoyed not knowing if its the PIR or the switch that has control.

 

[ex_directory]

Great thanks.

The PIR is above the switch, it is a single switch, so if the switch is on, light will be on, if the switch is off, it will be the PIR.

Reason I want the switch is it is a coat/shoes room so planning on having quite a short timeout on the PIR, but if for some reason someone was spending more than a few seconds in the room then they could flick the switch rather than remembering to move every few seconds!

 

[JohnW2]

Yes, that would work. But I'll bet you'll get annoyed not knowing if its the PIR or the switch that has control.

...and annoyed by being unexpectedly plunged into darkness.

Most people I know (including myself) who have put PIRs inside houses have eventually been driven mad by (and therefore removed) most of them! I still have a few, mainly on stairs/landings, but in situations in which there is not 'total darkness' when they go off.

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

Reason I want the switch is it is a coat/shoes room so planning on having quite a short timeout on the PIR, but if for some reason someone was spending more than a few seconds in the room then they could flick the switch rather than remembering to move every few seconds!

Does this room (or is it really a 'cupboard'?) have a door which is usually shut? If so, a door-operated switch might be less potentially annoying.

Kind Regards, John

 

[ex_directory]

...and annoyed by being unexpectedly plunged into darkness.

Most people I know (including myself) who have put PIRs inside houses have eventually been driven mad by (and therefore removed) most of them! I still have a few, mainly on stairs/landings, but in situations in which there is not 'total darkness' when they go off.

Kind Regards, John

Interesting comment....

I will report back as this would be a room where total darkness would occur, especially at this time of year!

 

[ex_directory]

Does this room (or is it really a 'cupboard'?) have a door which is usually shut? If so, a door-operated switch might be less potentially annoying.

Kind Regards, John

It is a room with a window and there is always some light outside. Door probably shut, but as you walk in the room, door shuts again = fire door.

PIR will be set to 30 seconds or more of no activity before switching off anyway.

Also, adding in a ceiling pir was easy as i have access to joist right now, running cables to door is more making good.

 

[JohnW2]

Interesting comment.... I will report back as this would be a room where total darkness would occur, especially at this time of year!

I suppose the main question is how often the 'over-ride' switch is likely to be operated.

We have a 'walk-in wardrobe', which may be similar to what you have, and we used to have a light switch just inside it. However, the light got left on so often that I eventually changed it to a door-operated switch. In another similar situation (with a switch inside), I have a small light above the outside of the door which is wired in parallel with the interior light - so that it becomes obvious if the light has been left on with the door shut.

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

Also, adding in a ceiling pir was easy as i have access to joist right now, running cables to door is more making good.

Fair enough. It would probably be just as easy for you to install a pull switch in the ceiling, but there would then be a risk of the light being left on (unless you had a 'repeater'light outside the door, such as I have just described).

Anyway, you probably didn't want us to be 'arguing' about what you're doing. As you have been told, your proposed wiring of the PIR would be fine!

Kind Regards, John

 

[ex_directory]

Fair enough. It would probably be just as easy for you to install a pull switch in the ceiling, but there would then be a risk of the light being left on (unless you had a 'repeater'light outside the door, such as I have just described).

Anyway, you probably didn't want us to be 'arguing' about what you're doing. As you have been told, your proposed wiring of the PIR would be fine!

Kind Regards, John

Thanks, I will report back and let you know if it works or if the kids (or I) constantly leave the switch on!

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Use a light which consumes very little electricity, and have a timer switch. Set the time delay to as long as anybody would ever need.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Does this room (or is it really a 'cupboard'?) have a door which is usually shut? If so, a door-operated switch might be less potentially annoying.

People will leave the door open.

 

[JohnW2]

People will leave the door open.

Provided it is in a 'used' part of the house, the open door will be an obvious indicator that it needs to be closed (and hence switch off the light).

If you're concerned that, for some strange reason, people might find a way of 'almost' closing it, so that it looks closed but is not quite closed enough to activate the switch, then use a spring-operated door opener or closer, so that the situation cannot arise. My wardrobe with a door switch has a self-closing door.

Kind Regards, John

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Mechanical gubbins layered onto mechanical gubbins to deal with the underlying problem of people who can't be trusted to turn off a light, (or possibly close a door) seems daft.

But if they really really can't then the simplest, minimal solution is the one to aim for - IMO swapping the switch. Fitting a PIR and an override for it is already moving too far from the simple.

 

[JohnW2]

Mechanical gubbins layered onto mechanical gubbins to deal with the underlying problem of people who can't be trusted to turn off a light, (or possibly close a door) seems daft.

It does seem daft, but given that people (including myself) cannot be trusted to always remember to turn off a light (the usual scenario is a handful of stuff and the 'intention' to come back and turn the light off!), there is a 'need' for some sort of technological assistance.

In these days of very low power consumption lights, the wastage/cost of electricity is no long much of an issue, but I'm not totally comfortable with the idea that a light could remain energised for weeks or months inside, say, a closed wardrobe.

The 'cannot be trusted' is not new. I remember my grandfather discovering that he had left a light on in his 'beach hut' or somesuch (I didn't even know that such things came with electricity, particularly back then!) for an entire winter!

Kind Regards, John