Altering a bathroom circuit - changes to distribution board?

[quattro64]

Hello everyone,
I wonder if someone can help me please.
I have just completed my Domstic Installer Scheme and am in the proces of becomming Part P registered. I have also reserved a place on the next regs course at my local training centre. In the meantime I have a question concerning an alteration in a bathroom. The current fuseboard is quite old and doesnt have any RCD's. The customer wishes to have a couple of low voltage luminaires fitted to replace the existing standard ceiling rose. Will the circuit need to be fitted with an RCD to comply with the current regs? or is the fact that it is an existing circuit make it exempt from this
ind regards

 

[GaryMo]

All new installations, additions or alterations should comply with BS7671:2008 (current), afterall, you'll be certifying to say that they do.

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

Yep!
You will need to install a RCD on to all new work.

 

[quattro64]

Many thanks for the speedy replies, can someone reccomend the best / easiest way to do this?
Regards

 

[rebuke]

If you can swap the current MCB (assuming it's actually got breakers and not rewireable fuses at the moment) for an RCBO, that would be ideal, but as you say it's an old board it's unlikely you can get an appropriate RCBO.

The next easiest option is probably to put in an RCD FCU outside the bathroom supplying the lighting etc in there.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Here we go again - same old failure of people to abide by the definition of "circuit".

quattro - read this: http://www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=176560&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0. The debate has been done to death, but at the end of the day you have to decide what you believe the regs require because you have to sign to say that to the best of your knowledge and belief etc...

 

[quattro64]

Thanks for your replies - and the link to that past thread (took a while to chew through!) I can see the pros and cons of the various options but IMO it is a bit of a mine field interpreting the regs - especially for someone like my self who is a freshly certificated domestic installer!
Regards

 

[GaryMo]

Without coming across as a smart ar*e, you're accepting money to carry out electrical work so you should know what you're doing and be able to interprit BS7671:2008 especially something so cut and dried as this.

Why did you think that an addition to an existing circuit wouldn't need to comply with BS7671:2008?

 

[quattro64]

Without coming across as a smart ar*e, you're accepting money to carry out electrical work so you should know what you're doing and be able to interprit BS7671:2008 especially something so cut and dried as this.

Why did you think that an addition to an existing circuit wouldn't need to comply with BS7671:2008?

No, I dont think you're being a smarta**e I think I could have worded my original question better, I am aware that all new work needs to comply with BS7671:2008, however wanted to check on the situation with existing work and if that had to be brought up to current standards when making an addition to it. It appears that a similar topic was discussed some time ago here http://www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=176560&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0. and created much debate with mixed opinions from people I assume to be experienced electricians so didnt appear to be that cut and dried. I have a copy of the regs which I am studying and have enrolled in a course for them too which I will complete before taking on any work. I just always ask questions on anything i wish to clarify.

 

[Taylortwocities]

I won't add to the above debate but, as you have a nice new copy of the regulations, you need to look closely at the definitions section. In particular "Voltage, nominal".

In you original post you said

The customer wishes to have a couple of low voltage luminaires fitted to replace the existing standard ceiling rose.

Now, having read the regs you will know that the existing standard ceiling light is, by definition, low voltage.

So, what sort of luminaires do you now plan to install?


I'm not being a sm*rt ass. As you are starting out its important that you get the terminology right (especially on this forum ).

 

[electronicsuk]

It appears that a similar topic was discussed some time ago here http://www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=176560&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0. and created much debate with mixed opinions from people I assume to be experienced electricians so didnt appear to be that cut and dried.

I'm not sure why that topic dragged on for quite so long. In this case, the fact is, adding an RCD FCU is not likely to add more than £50 in parts and labour cost to the job, it will provide increased safety in the bathroom, and it guarantees compliance with the regs regardless of your interpretation of them. To some it may seem belt-and-braces, to others, it will appear to be what is required.

 

[quattro64]

I won't add to the above debate but, as you have a nice new copy of the regulations, you need to look closely at the definitions section. In particular "Voltage, nominal".

In you original post you said

The customer wishes to have a couple of low voltage luminaires fitted to replace the existing standard ceiling rose.

Now, having read the regs you will know that the existing standard ceiling light is, by definition, low voltage.

So, what sort of luminaires do you now plan to install?


I'm not being a sm*rt ass. As you are starting out its important that you get the terminology right (especially on this forum ).

Thank you, havent finished reading the regs yet but i should have said Extra Low Voltage

 

[quattro64]

It appears that a similar topic was discussed some time ago here http://www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=176560&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0. and created much debate with mixed opinions from people I assume to be experienced electricians so didnt appear to be that cut and dried.

I'm not sure why that topic dragged on for quite so long. In this case, the fact is, adding an RCD FCU is not likely to add more than £50 in parts and labour cost to the job, it will provide increased safety in the bathroom, and it guarantees compliance with the regs regardless of your interpretation of them. To some it may seem belt-and-braces, to others, it will appear to be what is required.

Thanks Matthew, if and when I do the job this will be the route I shall take, the fuseboard is an old Wirelex with push button breakers and I dont think that there are MCBO's available for it. I do agree with you that going overboard is preferable to not achieveing compliance.
Regards