AQUAPANELS OVER STUDWORK

[RobinV]

Hi I am just about to fit out a new shower room. It is in an area that consists of an outside wall and three internal walls. The main quadrant shower enclosure will fit against a studwork wall that has plasterboard under which is a heavy gauge plaster membrane, and the other wall a plaster boarding that consists of compacted straw (from the original build)
Both walls are in excellent condition as they stand.

Because of the potential for damp penetration, I would prefer to use aquapanel to fix the tiling to, certainly in the shower cubicle. In the case of the studwork and plaster wall, should I remove the plasterboard first or simply bond and screw through the plasterboard?

On the other wall, I was thinking of bonding and screwing through the aquapanel using the appropriate plugs?

Is it also worth lining the floor under the shower tray with aqua panel?



Is this the best way to do it or are there any other suggestions?

Thanks

 

[JerryM]

i have thought of using aquapanel or marine ply on a few refits but in the end never have. if i was planning a wet room then i think it would be different (potential for water pooling as opposed to draining).

i just use standard plasterboard and mount the tray on a mortar bed (as per supplier’s instructions). what i do make sure though is the grout is waterproof (i use a latex admix to be sure) and use the best quality silicon.

my thinking is that i don't want to get water penetration in the 1st place. what it does mean though is you need to keep an eye on the condition of the silicon.

if you did want to use the aquapanel then i think your thoughts to fix to the existing would be fine.

 

[RobinV]

Hi there. Thanks for the reply. I haven't come across this latex admix you mention. Is that freely available in stores, or is it part of a certain make of grout?

Sounds like just what I will need for regrouting my existing bathroom as well.

Regards

Robin

 

[JerryM]

Mine is called "latex polymer additive" which is a white liquid emulsion in a 5L container. i buy from my local tile shop. i think builders merchants probably also stock. i have found it expensive (~20£) in some shops so beware and phone around. i use it with any make of grout.

from the grout & latex instructions i end up pretty much substituting 2/3 of the water with the admix.

i also make sure i buy waterproof grout - not water resistant. i got my last from focus. you also need to leave finished grout area as long as you can before using (getting it wet) - 3 days min or 7 days if you can hang on. this makes sure it has fully sealed itself.

 

[tiler jase]

Sorry jerry but i guarantee you that your grout is most defininately not waterproof regardless of the additives you put with it. In short the shower area substrates you have been doing will still be getting damaged. The backs of the tiles will still be getting wet within one to two minutes of a shower being used. The only true waterproof grout is epoxy resin based and costs a small fortune. Its a huge mistake many many people make as i also used to. All adhesive and grout manufacturers sell waterproof adhesives and grouts but what it actually means is they do not deterioate when subject to water such as shower areas. The true definition is water resistant. All the latex additive will do is give you increased flexibility in the grout which is ideal if youre using porcelain tiles but no use for waterproofing.Dont take my word for it though contact BAL tiling products in stoke and they will tell you the same!

 

[JerryM]

tiler jase i won't disagree with what you say as i'm not a trained tiler. all i can provide is actual hands on experience. i have had 2 showers with the stated grout for over 3 yrs in daily use (they are not power showers but have excellent flow - one's got the header tank in the loft and the other's on a combi, one's over a bath and one's a 2 sided cubicle over a tray).

it may well be the flexibility that's making the difference as opposed to the "waterproof". i am a damp proofer and very aware that wood sucks up water like no tomorrow and at 20% moisture rot will set in. the walls/floor surrounding the showers show no damp readings on my meter. the only tiles i use are ceramic which i believe are "waterproof".

i would not use the approach on porous tiles ie limestone or porcelain as the water will get through the tile whatever the grout is. i do not put any sealer ie PVA on the plasterboard before tiling either (known cause of tiles coming loose).

would agree the BAL site is worth a read. the true test for me is will i do the same on my next shower. all i can say is yes which i have to be sure of as i have to put any wrongs right myself with sweat & tears.

for info i came by the method through trial and error. i have had a tiled kitchen worktop (50x50 white tiles) for 18yrs. it's brill in all respects except that the grout used to permanently stain and could not be cleaned (grout made white again with bleach). i even tried epoxy without success - it's also a nightmare to use.

 

[tiler jase]

Jerrym. Its not so much the tile letting water pass through its always the grout (appart from the obvious natural stone tiles). The problem is that a continual steady flow over the months and years lets the water pass through the grout which slowly creates the damage to the substrate. All grouts are cement based and all are porous apart from the epoxy. Its between one to two minutes before the backs of the tiles become wet with water getting through the grout (BAL again!).
Just a thought though check out the aquamix range of cleaners and tile care from america. They do a a liquid form of expoxy colourant in lots of colours.You clean the existing grout and then apply with a toothbrush or similar and let it dry for an hour before washing off with an emulsifying pad and lots of clean water. The result is a sealed grout which wont stain.Superb stuff and really easy to use.Saves loads of time regrouting and lots of pennies.

 

[JerryM]

jase appreciate your thoughts. had a good look at the aquamix site and seems impressive. could not pick out the trade name or where to buy in uk. i've tried something similar before but not good (not saying the aquamix is not the business) - it was a right job getting the sealer off the tiles.

for the mo i am quite happy. if water does get through the latex grout then it's sufficiently small to dissipate naturally as i can't get damp readings on the back of the plaster board and there’s no hollow tap on the tiles so for me i can sleep ok.

for info the admix i use is Excel Bond who have v.good tech helpline 0800 3890138. i have simply increased the amount of admix and reduced the water.

 

[andrew.richardson]

I agree with a lot of your comments here. Waterproof grout is not waterproof - it changes colour when touched by water. i.e. its letting water through.
The safest thing to do is two-fold:-

1) Use a waterproof board - with reinforcement in the board faces. Where you can.
2) Use a waterproofing agent over the boards and a flexible tape over the junctions (i.e. wall-to-wall or wall-to-floor). The waterproofing agent (usually paintable) has an associated sealer, and can be used to bed the flexible tape.

You can get these from BAL, Ardex, mapei, Fermacell. Each of these manufacturers has user guides or data sheets on these.
They are all easy to use and give peace of mind for splashback areas.

Hope this helps.

 

[Bon]

Even Aquapanel is not 100% waterproof. My advice (which may seem a little over the top, but helps you sleep at night) would be to Aquapanel the wet areas and then use a tanking kit (BAL do a good one available from a well-known tiling chain). This is a flexible liquid membrane which you paint/trowel on. You also get lengths of tape for joins in the Aquapanel and wall to floor.

This means that any water that gets through the tiles (which will happen as no grout is waterproof to the point where it wont allow water to penetrate, IIRC waterproof grout means water does not affect its properties, i.e. won't wash it away) will then meet the membrane which is waterproof.

Do a search for tanking as there's loads of info on here.