Bathroom 'Damp' Problem

[madnesstiger]

Hi All,

I am new to the forum, and thought it would be the best place to pose a few queries with regards my degenerating bathroom!

For a little while now, I have noticed black specks of mould appear around the top corners of my bathroom. The one I am mostly concerned about is the corner which consists of 2 'external' walls. I have taken photos to show what has occured...

Can anyone advise as to what my problem may be, and how to rectify it?

Here's a some more info to bear in mind:

The bathroom is very small in size, and is used daily for showers (over bath).

The wooden-panel ceiling is 'supsended', hanging maybe a foot below the original ceiling height. Is this type of roof generally ok for bathrooms? Or would it be best to attempt to open up the ceiling to it's full height?

The textured paint (as seen peeling away from the walls) - is this generally accepted for use in bathrooms? Also, I think the paint may well be general emulsion rather than anti-fungicidal paint.

There is no extractor fan fitted. There is a window fitted which we gerally leave ajar (maybe an inch at most).

I moved into the house 6 years ago, and I havent touched this room in terms of decorating etc.

Thanks for any advice guys.

 

[Blasphemous]

First off, that suspended wooden ceiling has got to come down. I suspect it's absorbing moisture within the bathroom. Wood is like a sponge where moisture is concerned. Second, when the ceiling comes down you may find that the mould is worse behind there. Don't let that discourage you, the longer you leave it the bigger the problem will become. Third, I also suspect that the 'Stipple Effect' decoration on the walls (often called 'Artex'), is holding moisture too. My advice would be to remove it. Be careful though. Depending on the age of the 'Artex' it could contain asbestos. All Artex has been free of asbestos for around 20-30 years now, so if it is a newish house then it should be fine. If you don't know how old it is, then you can get it tested. You'll need a specialist removal company if it does come back as containing Asbestos.

I understand that you say you leave the window ajar but it's probably not enough. Obviously a bathroom is a VERY moist room. If the warm air within that room is not allowed to vent and cooler dry air allowed in, then the warm air will form condensation which over time develops a mould.

The only other thing I'd add is, what is above that ceiling? Is it a roof and if so, is the roof in good order? It may be leaking but you cannot see it due to the suspended wooden ceiling.

Assuming the roof is fine then it really is very simple, increase ventilation to the room. Remove the wooden ceiling and do any remedial work required and clean up the mould and renew any rotten areas. Once all this is done you should have no further problems.

Hope that helps.

 

[madnesstiger]

Thanks for your detailed reply and for taking the time to do so

I'm dreading what I'll find above the wooden ceiling! It is indeed the corner of the loft area above the bathroom - I had a quick look from the outside and couldn't see anything obviously wrong with the roof. The problem's been building up gradually over the past months, and has got to the point where I really need to do something about it!

I'll follow your advice, and have also been advised to install a 150mm extractor fan.

Thanks again.

MT

 

[Blasphemous]

The Extractor Fan will help. In the mean time, if you can stand the cold (I know I'm evil), then leaving the window open a little more will also help. But if you are leaving it open when you are out of the house then obviously only do so if you deem it safe.... ie criminals gaining access. Opening it further than you normally do when taking a shower/bath will again help but I appreciate it's very cold at the moment.

 

[madnesstiger]

I've managed to pull away a piece of wood which was above the window, gaining access for my camera to take some shots of what I'm to face in the coming days!

While the internal walls looked to be ok (just need a wiping down), the external walls (particularly where the 2 external walls meet in the corner) look awful and black, with moisture almost running down the walls! The ceiling is in a similar state - black towards the external walls, and dripping water accross the entire ceiling.

What I did find interesting is that the wooden suspended ceiling is covered with a ~6" layer of loft insulation, which I'm sure wouldn't be helping matters! One more thing of note is that there are 2 slide-type plastic vents above the bath, built into the wooden ceiling... this must be leading the condensation up into the gap between the ceilings, and having nowhere to escape, thus causing the chaos up there. It's a wonder the dripping water hasn't interrupted with the light fitting (standard bayonet lightbulb)!

God knows where I'm going to start, but for now may I ask, what is the best way of 'drying out' the original ceiling etc? And also, what sort of treatment would need applying to it?

I think the rest of the work is going to be basically stripping away the paint and tiles etc and re-decorating. It's the ceiling which I think I'm more concerned about.

Thanks again for your time, and I'll definately follow your advice. Thankyou.

 

[Blasphemous]

No problem madnesstiger.

I think from the sounds of it your 'original' ceiling ie above that wooden suspended one, will have to be renewed! Its quite a messy job but one consolation is it's the bathroom so its easy to clean and you're ripping out most of the stuff from the walls etc anyway. I'd pretty much bet that the plaster will be ruined with all that damp. But make sure you definitely haven't got a leak in the roof before you start renewing any plasterboards etc. If you can gain access to the loft you'll be able to see if there is any damp areas above that area of the ceiling. From the looks of the original pictures I'd not be surprised if there is some damp but you are looking for damp on the roof timbers. Also, if you go up when its raining there's a fair bet you'll see a leak if it's there. Sorry I don't know your knowledge level so I am advising as per you have never been in a loft before. Please be very careful when inside the loft. You can NOT stand on the areas 'between' the ceiling joists (which will be at your feet once you're up there obviously), unless the loft has been boarded out. The areas between the joists will be either Plaster Board or Lath and Plaster. They CANNOT take any weight. If you're not sure or unsteady on your feet try to find someone to ask to help you. You'll also need a decent lamp/torch to see up there.

To be honest, my money would be on bad ventilation and bad construction of that suspended wooden ceiling having led to the problems you have. In all, it's a very solvable problem. The greatest expense will probably be re-plastering. And if you are having the ceiling done, get a price for the walls as well. It might be worth it.

Good luck with it. Hope I have been able to help.

 

[madnesstiger]

You've helped immensly, and I appreciate your time and advice.

I mentioned I took some 'blind' photos through the gap above the window...

Here's the results (working from the worst corner, around to the opposite internal walls):

Renewing the ceiling sounds expensive.. wish you hadn't mentioned that bit just before bedtime!

I went into the loft to see if the original ceiling was infact still there.. and it was! However, as the bathroom is in the corner of the house, it may be quite awkward to get over into the corner of the loft.

Anyhow, see what you think of the photos above, and please let me know if there's anything else I should know before 'getting started'.

Thanks again

 

[Blasphemous]

YEP, my money is on condensation!

JohnD is on here tonight. Wadda ya reckon John?

It's obviously entirely up to you how you move forward with this tiger (ain't that just a great name?). But my advice is that you should definitely remove that false ceiling. However, if you want to try to keep it for the time being to save for a 'full job', then you could knock through a brick just above the false ceiling and insert a vent. ie knock out a brick in the wall to outside. This would allow the area above the ceiling to 'breath' and probably stop that mould problem getting any worse. I'd recommend you either install a vent to the bathroom as well or open the window wider.

As I say, this will probably stop the problem getting any worse and buy you time to save for the bathroom to be done tiger.

 

[madnesstiger]

Hi (again!),

I kinda like knowing the problem is condensation, rather than a leaky lid!

Since last night, I have left the small space (where I stuck the camera up through) uncovered and have had the window open wider all day.

I can feel it is much 'fresher' in there already and have noticed the is already an airbrick between the two ceilings (although unable to check if it's blocked until I remove the wooden ceiling).

My plan of action is to go ahead and remove all the wood, thus exposing the airbrick and letting the whole room in general get a better circulation of fresh air. I will then attempt to clean up whatever I find up there the best I can for now, and put up with a very odd-looking bathroom until the walls and ceiling have dried out alot more. Only then will I figure what needs repairing/replacing/decorating!

 

[Blasphemous]

Best way tiger. You'll be glad you did in the end as damp conditions are not good for buildings. Good luck with it.

Till next time.