Boiler kettling

[croydoncorgi]

If you're lucky, there may be a drainoff on the boiler itself. If so, you may have more luck getting the crud out of it through that.

Otherwise, if you're considering taking the thing apart(!!!), you might be wiser to just try taking the pipes off it and flushing it in isolation. Having enough space and time to do this (and making a mess) has to be a consideration.

 

[Soggy_weetabix]

The safest solution so far appears to be to take the HE out of the boiler and fill with DS3.
However, I think thats a bit beyond my skills!

It wont work!

I use ds40 because it does exacly what it says on the tin (well, tub...whatever).
If your boiler is sludged, so is the rest of the system.

The stuff really is good but STRONG!

Id only ever use DS3 to water my flowers. Its that strong

David

 

[Agile]

Sulphamic acid ( DS3 ) is only effective at elevated temperatures, ideally above 80*C so its of little use unless it can be heated up somehow such as in a working boiler.

If the HE is taken out then you can use HCl providing you can handle it safely. Its pretty effective in a 10% solution at about 15*C and even better at about 30*C. Should not be used unless you are competent and have protective equipment.

Tony

 

[kevplumb]

steady tony
you are getting dangerously close to agreeing with me

 

[Largemoo]

Took the plunge a few weeks ago and added the DS40.
left it in for a week (as it says on the tin) and flushed etc.

now complete silence - just slight purring.

thanks for all the advice etc.

 

[tessaanddennis]

Largemoo (David/Tony & all) - Saw/read this thread as I have a ‘kettling’ problem starting with my 13 year old Ideal Mexico super8 RS80 floor standing boiler (gravity fed hot water, pumped c/h), but the piping/ pump/radiators are around 35 years old, h/w tank 20 y/o. This is the second boiler for the system. I seem to remember apprehensively using DS40 for the first boiler when it was about 15 y/o (and kettling) and had no problems. Then it started kettling again 7 years later. The system was then cleaned out again, and the boiler replaced with the present boiler. Yes, so it’s a question of which product should I use to flush it out with this time? - Do I risk using DS 40 again?

Largemoo - How old was your boiler system when you used DS 40? How is the boiler/system now, some 8 years later on now?

Kevplumb – what would you do?

I installed the pipework & raditors 35 yeaers ago, but not the boiler. I could drain/flush the system still, but at 65 - getting a little old for much else now, and my interest in DIY not as strong as it was!

Richard

 

[Largemoo]

Tessaanddennis

there are some psychic forces at work here because my boiler is kettling again and I thought I'd check my old posy out to review what advice I got 6 years ago - only to find that today you've added your question to it - spooky!

The boiler is years old, it was in the house when we bought it 10 years ago and my guess is that it's now about 20-25 years old

after using the ds40 everything was fine for a number of years but over the past couple of years the dreaded knocking has returned.

I did have some doubts about using it but figured that as long as followed the instructions to the letter, Id be fine and it was.

not sure this time what to do - clearly a new boiler would be sensible but I've been told that a new boilder would need to go on an outside wall - currently, the old one is in the middle of the house with the exhaust going up the chimney

personally, I think that ds40 repairs the problem and for a permanant solution you (and i) need to cure the cause - which to be honest I'm not sure of - some say hard water, some say air in the system?

Anyway - good luck hoped I've helped in some way

 

[tessaanddennis]

Not so spooky really - After I used DS4 on my first boiler (around 1992) the dreaded banging came back in about 6-7 years, much like yours now! That was when I got a new boiler - in hindsight I wish I had persevered with it – prior to putting in the new one, they cleaned the system - and yes the boiler stopped banging!! Food for thought? Reading lots of the posts, many of the experts ‘bang on’ about how good the old boilers were compared to the new ones now! In fact I came across one thread that was devoted to fitters/experts grading boilers - good, OK, avoid.

I agree the main cause is likely to be hard water as I am in the SE. When I got the new boiler in 1999 I considered a water softener, and something else similar I seem to remember that you clamped on the pipes I think, but took the easy route - do nothing!

Incidentally, when you say you ‘…checked your old posy’… do you mean by chance, or did you get a message from diynot.com that you had a new message? In looking over the site for advice I got the impression most of the correspondence was around 2004-2006 – not a lot recently. The only response I have had to my post is yours - so if I write again, I will try a new question possibly.

As to the present, when I’m being optimistic I can convince myself it is OK, but …..I have experienced the ‘signs’ of kettling before so…..! It’s just starting, so I have some time before I have to do something. As to the future, your boiler /system was probably about 15 years old when you used DS40. Needless to say like you, with our systems that much older, (mine 13boiler,/system 33) I am very loath/worried about going for DS40 this time round! Also I am loath to take radiators off - I have heard that that can cause problems. I am presently minded to go for X400 with a lot of pre & post flushing. Any comments out there?

Richard

 

[JohnD]

I used both the Fernox acid cleaners when my old iron Potterton bonked badly. I managed to quieten it for a while, but not long considering all the time and effort it took. When I had a new boiler fitted, I looked down into the iron heat exchanger of the old one, and I reckon the water flow would be very unlikely to wash away any particles, rust or scale.

If you can do basic plumbing and can afford £100 for a good system filter, it will trap any circulating particles. Use some X400 and you will be surprised at the sediment that it dislodges and will be trapped in the filter. It will keep the system cleaner which will do nothing but good. You can leave it in for 4 weeks of normal use before draining and rinsing out the loosened particles. If you have a system filter to catch the circulating particles, it does no harm to leave the X400 in permanently (but if you do not remove the loosened sludge by draining or trapping it, it will eventually settle again).

If you are sure you have limescale in the boiler, the new(ish) Sentinel X200 (which you add to the system and leave permanently) will "dissolve" limescale over time. It is not an acid cleaner.

Black sludge is often quite soft, but some blockages look black, but are very hard, and are said to be a combination of black magnetite with limescale.

If you have any leaks and the water has to be topped up from the F&E, you will constantly be adding fresh oxygenated water, which will encourage corrosion, and also add more limescale.