BT Telephone Master - Toolstation replacement query

[MHAD]

Hi folks,

My BT master socket is in our master bedroom, which I'm currently redecorating. I'll be replacing all sockets, switches, TV points etc with screwless flat chrome.

I've bought a phone socket from Toolstation, described as a Master, listed here (item # 52322) http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Electrical/ScrewlessFlatChrome/d190/sd3110

The problem is, the socket only has krone type connections 1-6 on the back, nothing else. The ring capacitor is there so I could see that this socket would be fine for the phone that is plugged into the front, however for extension wiring there is nowhere else to wire to - I'd have to wire the extension wiring and the line from outside to the same krone connections, which I seem to remember is a bad thing.

Does anyone know whether this would be OK? Thanks.

 

[cleverspark]

Hi Im not an expert on this so take my answer with a pinch of salt,
but I have wired my phone lines all from the the same socket, as you suggest and I have had no problems upto now
the only problem i have found though with buying such "master sockets" is they do not have the surge protection in there, not sure how much this is needed as was so long ago I done mine I forgot what the outcome was from speaking with people.
However, my thought is go for it

fire extingusiher on standby incase i am shot down in flames

 

[Chri5]

Right- BT will get antsy if you remove the old master socket / NTE box that they own and is the main demarcation point between your stuff (customer supplied) and theirs.

So from the BT master socket you terminate 3 wires on the 2,5,and 3.

Since you have a master BT socket, from the BT socket all other sockets should be simple secondary units (without the capacitor).
So cut the capacitor out of your master if you don't want to exchange it (it will work as a 2ndry)

These wires should be Blue/white 2, White blue 5 and White orange 3 when using BT 1308 cable (3 or 4 pair normal).

This then gets a simple daisy chain from socket to socket, with all 3 wires of each cable (one cable in, one out) terminating on the same krone IDC terminals 2, 5 and 3

Krone terminals are design to have a few cable cores terminated one over the top of the other. Terminate them one at a time and always visual / tug test the terminated wire.

 

[TicklyT]

Your new socket may be a master socket, but it is not an NTE5, which is the current standard network termination used by various network providers.

NTE5s provide the demarcation and test point between the customer's wiring and the network supplier's wiring.

The network supplier may take a very dim view if a fault is reported (not necessarily by you) and when they come to test it, their test point has disappeared

As far as I am aware, the NTE5 sockets are only available in white plastic, and remain the property of the network supplier, much like gas and electricity meters.

Older installations just used a master socket on the end of the line, and the line and extension wiring shared the same terminals, but that was when both the line and the extension wiring was supplied by the network supplier. Changes in the market led to the introduction of a standardised network termination point (NTE) defining the interface between the network supplier's wiring and the customer's wiring.

 

[bigzed]

As far as I am aware, the NTE5 sockets are only available in white plastic, and remain the property of the network supplier, much like gas and electricity meters.

That is correct.

These wires should be Blue/white 2, White blue 5 and White orange 3 when using BT 1308 cable (3 or 4 pair normal).

Nearly correct Chris, the actual conductor to be terminated on T3 is Orange with White Rings.

I wouldn't recommend taking ALL your extensions off the same master socket. Usually, the Krone strip can handle two terminations with ease. When the sockets first came out ( about 1981 or so ), the GPO stated that up to three terminations can be made on each terminal. That has now changed to two, due to the amount of faults we started to go back on where the last cable terminated started to go dis.

I would suggest that the best course of action would be to buy an NTE5A off one of the many sellers on eBay ( and while you're there, buy a faceplate adsl splitter as well ) for around a tenner. The main incoming feed will terminate on the screw terminals at the rear of the main plate ( any way round will do - they aren't leg conscious ) and all your extensions should be daisy-chained ( as Chri5 correctly says ) off the removeable backplate.

All these extensions will then also have the adsl carrier signal filtered out. The later versions of the adsl plate also have separate, unfiltered terminals on the rear that allow you to extend the adsl signal to any socket on the run of cable by using the Green/White pair.

 

[MHAD]

Thanks for the replies.

Looks like I can't swap the master socket for a nice chrome one then.

I wonder why so called "master" sockets are made / sold then if it's not permitted to replace the BT NTE5.

Maybe I should move the master socket into the loft alongside my structured cabling and server stuff. Would I need BT to do this or could I do it myself?

 

[Chri5]

BT records do not show the location of an NTE in a premises.

The reason masters are commonly available is for PABX phone systems where POT's plain ord phones will require the master to work.

Sorry about the cock up on the wiring 3 as pointed out should be orange/ white, but as mentioned as long as the same colour wire is terminated in the daisy chain to 2.5 and 3 there's no issue.

Reason I messed it up? Well that's because white orange is normal to a PABX system requiring earth recall via LJU 4

 

[plugwash]

Maybe I should move the master socket into the loft alongside my structured cabling and server stuff. Would I need BT to do this or could I do it myself?

You aren't supposed to touch it but provided you don't replace any cable with DIY grade stuff BT are very unlikely to notice it wasn't them who put it there.

 

[TicklyT]

Thanks for the replies.

Looks like I can't swap the master socket for a nice chrome one then.

I wonder why so called "master" sockets are made / sold then if it's not permitted to replace the BT NTE5.

Maybe I should move the master socket into the loft alongside my structured cabling and server stuff. Would I need BT to do this or could I do it myself?

Master sockets are sold for things like private telephone systems (PABXs) and the like, which may require them for each extension telephone that is connected.

Service providers usually know that you have an NTE5 on your line, but not where it is in the house. (I would never advocate moving it, of course )

If your NTE5 was next to your structured wiring, you could use that to distribute telephony as well as data. There are 'dongles' available to connect telephones to RJ45 sockets, and RJ11 telephone plugs can be plugged straight into RJ45 outlets.