central heating from a log burner

[AstonHill]

Greetings!

So I have a log burner with a built in back burner. Hear is what I bough https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/115981134053
I would like to run a central heating system with radiators piped up to it. First I would like to do only one radiator/ room with it, but then more on afterwoods

I am wondering how I would plumb this up? Is it as straight forward as running 2 pipes from the boiler to the radiator on a loop system with a pump in the middle? (no header tank)

If so then
1. Is the bottom of the boiler pipe the inlet and the top of the boiler pipe the out let?
2. Is the bottom of the radiator ports the inlet and the top of the radiator ports the out let?
3. Should the pump be on the bottom of the system or the top?
4. How much flow ratio should the pump produce for a standard 15mm pipe?
5. Dose it all need to be copper pipe used or can some of it be PVC? (radiator and boiler 14' 6" appart)

Thanks

PS there is no other boilers or heaters in the system or on site!

 

[Exedon]

First thing would do is fill that boiler with water and pressure test it to make sure it actually holds water.
Solid fuel systems all metal
Boiler flow on top
Only one rad should be suitably sized and piped to boiler output to work as a 'heat leak rad'
Needs a feed tank (metal) to take up water expansion.
Lots of design stuff out there re solid fuel systems.

 

[muggles]

It's neither permitted by regulations nor safe to run a woodburner such as this on a sealed system with no header tank. It must be open vented (there are a couple of stoves out there now which can be run on sealed systems but they're mega expensive and this isn't one of them).

Flow to the top, return to the bottom. You can't rely on a pump for circulation, the system must be designed for predominantly gravity circulation. This is to ensure it doesn't become dangerous in the event of a power cut. Running a single radiator off this is likely to be insufficient. Do you know the kW / BTU rating of the stove and of the back boiler?

Minimum pipe size would be at least 22mm and more often 28mm, dependent on system size and pipework run. It must be all copper due to the high temperatures involved.

 

[AstonHill]

It's neither permitted by regulations nor safe to run a woodburner such as this on a sealed system with no header tank. It must be open vented (there are a couple of stoves out there now which can be run on sealed systems but they're mega expensive and this isn't one of them)

So you are saying it is unsafe to have a sealed system with no header tank? So dose my header need to be metal and air vented at the top then? and what size tank needed?

.

Flow to the top, return to the bottom.

Is that on the boiler or the radiator?

You can't rely on a pump for circulation, the system must be designed for predominantly gravity circulation. This is to ensure it doesn't become dangerous in the event of a power cut. Running a single radiator off this is likely to be insufficient.

Is this what they call Thermosiphon, I cant see it working i still see the need for the aid of a pump

Do you know the kW / BTU rating of the stove and of the back boiler?

Dont know

Minimum pipe size would be at least 22mm and more often 28mm, dependent on system size and pipework run. It must be all copper due to the high temperatures involved.

I can just about get a 22mm pipe inside of the pipe of the boiler, but dont the radiators use 15mm right?

 

[AstonHill]

First thing would do is fill that boiler with water and pressure test it to make sure it actually holds water.

I did fill it with water at the top but it soon came out the bottom end

Solid fuel systems all metal

Is that coz the tempratre can vary more then gas and oil

Boiler flow on top

???

Only one rad should be suitably sized and piped to boiler output to work as a 'heat leak rad'

???

Needs a feed tank (metal) to take up water expansion.

Dose the rad and boiler pipe to the feed tank in a loop or separate?

Lots of design stuff out there re solid fuel systems.

There are but all designs are no good! they are all for plumbing up a log burning boiler into an existing hearing system with an allready gas or oil
boiler

 

[Elkato531]

As muggles has said, there must be an unrestricted gravity (convection) circulation to an adequate heat sink. If you can't achieve this, don't go any further. Even after you've got that sorted, you have to deal with a damaged flue connection and bodge together a flue, plus deal with the missing door glass panels and seals.
You clearly don't have a clue what's needed to turn this piece of scrap iron into a safe, useable system. Cut your losses, take it to a scrap metal yard before you endanger yourself and others.

 

[AstonHill]

As muggles has said, there must be an unrestricted gravity (convection) circulation to an adequate heat sink. If you can't achieve this, don't go any further. Even after you've got that sorted, you have to deal with a damaged flue connection and bodge together a flue, plus deal with the missing door glass panels and seals.
You clearly don't have a clue what's needed to turn this piece of scrap iron into a safe, useable system. Cut your losses, take it to a scrap metal yard before you endanger yourself and others.

excuse me matty! it is now a fully working log burner

 

[Elkato531]

I very much doubt its a safely working log burner, but you crack on fella.

 

[bernardgreen]

excuse me matty! it is now a fully working log burner

Did you read this from the E-bay page​

Item specifics​

Condition
For parts or not working: An item that does not function as intended or is not fully operational. This includes items that are defective in ways that render them difficult to use, items that require service or repair, or items missing essential components.

Just because it can burn logs does NOT mean it is burning them safely.

A boiler or heater that is fueled by gas, oil or electric can be shut down by switching off the supply of fuel. Shutting down a solid fuel stove requires the means to safely remove burning fuel from the stove.

 

[AstonHill]

I very much doubt its a safely working log burner, but you crack on fella.

Then that shows you how very little you know!

 

[Mottie]

boiler into an existing hearing system

Eh? Speak up!

 

[AstonHill]

Eh? Speak up!

Well look they all look simular to this

 

[Mottie]

Louder. I can’t hear you.

 

[oldbutnotdead]

All the warnings mentioned above.
It won't be an Unbranded item- it looks like a Villager but i might be wrong.
If the thing does hold water (those elbows on the back look like 22mm) you'll need glass for the doors and an adaptor for the flue.
It looks quite small- possibly 10kw or less total output.
You absolutely MUST NOT connect it directly to a sealed system- if you do it WILL explode.

Heating the house solely from the woodburner is possible but not that satisfactory. Doesn't look as if there is a grate in that one so you'll only be able to burn wood. If you have free wood fine but at full chat you'll be stoking every 15 minutes or so. If you have to pay for wood you'll need deep pockets, cost per kwh is much higher than gas, think its approaching electric but not done the sums recently.

You'll need open vent system with metal f & e tank, tank as near vertically above the burner as possible

You'll need a heat dump radiator (capable of sinking at least 10% of the stove output) again as near vertically above the stove as possible, plumbed for thermal circulation (no valves, pumps etc in the way).

You can then hang additional pumped rads onto the system.

That sketch you've linked to is for a very specific brand of woodburner, it would NOT be safe to hook yours up in that fashion.

 

[AstonHill]

All the warnings mentioned above.
It won't be an Unbranded item- it looks like a Villager but i might be wrong.
If the thing does hold water (those elbows on the back look like 22mm)

I have a 22mm bit of pipe that fits neatly into the holes so I guess I will need a compresion nut and olive for it

you'll need glass for the doors and an adaptor for the flue.

Please read what I have written above

It looks quite small- possibly 10kw or less total output.
You absolutely MUST NOT connect it directly to a sealed system- if you do it WILL explode.

Got it! So header tank it is; must the tank be metal

Heating the house solely from the woodburner is possible but not that satisfactory. Doesn't look as if there is a grate in that one so you'll only be able to burn wood.

I have burnt wood, coal, plastic, waste oil in it so far

If you have free wood fine but at full chat you'll be stoking every 15 minutes or so. If you have to pay for wood you'll need deep pockets, cost per kwh is much higher than gas, think its approaching electric but not done the sums recently.

Did not know wood was more expencive per kwh then gas. But I know gas is or was about 3 times the price of electric

You'll need open vent system with metal f & e tank, tank as near vertically above the burner as possible

F&E tank? I take it you are refering to a header tank right, if so ignore my other question on it being metal

You'll need a heat dump radiator (capable of sinking at least 10% of the stove output) again as near vertically above the stove as possible, plumbed for thermal circulation (no valves, pumps etc in the way).

A heat dump radiator; what is this?

That sketch you've linked to is for a very specific brand of woodburner, it would NOT be safe to hook yours up in that fashion.

You have not seen any diagrams for a wood burner on its own by any chance?