Central Storage Heater timer?

[Ihatehardwork]

Hi,

Need some help on how to put timers on storage heaters. The heaters are supplied by a meter that works for about 14 hours a day in winter and all the time in the summer. I guess this must be some old historic tariff that is no longer sold (Southern).

The electricians I've spoken to don't really understand the set up at all. It's clearly very unusual now. I want to be able to instruct an electrician to do exactly what is needed, rather than keep being told that storage heaters "only work 7 hours a day".

The house has 9 storage heaters - there are a number of people living here.
There are 2 consumer units - one is general (sockets, lights etc) and one is for the storage heaters and the immersion heater. There are 2 meters - the 14 hour one is connected to an old "Horstmann" mechanical clock, which has been labelled "seasonal device", and this connects to the heating CU. The other meter connects to the general CU. (The immersion heater is on its own timer in the bathroom).

All the storage heaters have been repaired now (basic Dimplex XLN all models). I don't want them heating for 14 hours in the winter. But I probably don't want Economy 7 either, as the house needs to be warm all the time as the elderly people are there 7 x 24. I'm not really sure if the heaters will still be hot in the evening with Economy 7.
The tariffs aren't too bad either -they seem to be about the same as Economy 10.
What kind of timer can we install next to the CU to turn all the heaters on or off? Is this a bad idea for any reason?

The meters were replaced in 2009. It would have been great if all the supply worked on the cheaper meter in the summer, but I guess the load would be too much for one meter. Is that possible? The load can clearly be more than 100A when all the heaters come on (the heaters plus immersion heater could potentially draw 130A).

Any ideas appreciated.
Thx, Richard

 

[AndyPRK]

I think we could do with pictures of the meter and seasonal device.

One solution is to turn the thermostats down on the heaters to limit their on time.

 

[winston1]

You would need a timer with a battery backed up clock so that the clock still runs during the 6 hours the power is off. I assume you have one of these on the immersion heater otherwise it would not work as you say.

An electronic central heating timer would be the type. However finding one capable of switching 130 amps will be difficult. You could use a timer and separate contractor (noisy) or alternatively a separate timer on each storage heater.

 

[AndyPRK]

These are good for 80 Amps
and the clockwork spring keeps time during a power out.

 

[Ihatehardwork]

Thanks very much to both of you.

Yes, I have realised the immersion timer needs to be swapped out - it's not battery backed at the moment, so it's wasting money in the winter (when it's on for 14 hours).

Wow - I was hoping that someone would say that some company makes the kind of timer the storage heaters need.
Is the Venner device still made? It's looks old and can't find current stockists or models on Google.

(I said the storage heaters have been repaired. In actual fact, a builder has changed out the old heaters for secondhand ones. My mother has Alzheimers and it would be too disruptive to install different heating. Perhaps the "new" Dimplex XLN thermostats will be much better than the 1970s/1980s heaters? I'm hoping so.

I can post a photo tomorrow, if this will still help.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

The heaters are supplied by a meter that works for about 14 hours a day in winter and all the time in the summer.

Why would anybody devise a 2-tariff scheme which was designed to have storage heaters on 24x7 in the summer?

 

[JohnW2]

The heaters are supplied by a meter that works for about 14 hours a day in winter and all the time in the summer.

Why would anybody devise a 2-tariff scheme which was designed to have storage heaters on 24x7 in the summer?

Indeed. It almost sounds 'back to front' - OFF for 14 hours in winter (i.e. ON for 10 hours per day) and not on at all during the summer would perhaps make more sense!

Kind Regards, John

 

[AndyPRK]

The Venner device was fitted in the 1980's and could of been second hand then.

I think a picture would still be useful.

I suspect you will end up putting timers next to the heaters.

Some heaters you may wish to leave running as long as possible and turn the thermostats down.

 

[Ihatehardwork]

Thanks. Sorry for the delay in replying. Took a while to get the pictures. Here's the cabinet with the old fuse boxes. Each fuse box is connected to a meter via blocks (there is a 3rd box with a single fuse on the left too).
There's a picture of the Horstmann device too.
I noticed there's only a single 100A fuse on the intake for both meters, even though the storage heaters can draw that on their own.
Is that a problem? The meters were swapped out in 2009, but the fuse was not changed.
Updating this is getting complex. The cabinet would need to be rebuilt to fit bigger fuse boxes. And the timing still needs a solution. So I guess it might wait for next year after we see how it all performs - might just add a timer or two on individual heaters.
The tariff is really odd - and old - agreed. But it may be good value if we can keep the usage down.

Untitled

• Ihatehardwork
• 25 Jul 2014
• 1

Untitled

• Ihatehardwork
• 25 Jul 2014
• 1

Untitled

• Ihatehardwork
• 25 Jul 2014
• 1