Cheering in Parliament after motion to melt firefighters pay freeze...

"Corbyn, however, was not alone in attempting this so-called bid to “sabotage” the Queen’s speech. Earlier in the day, during debates regarding the Queen’s Speech, potential rebel Tories voiced similar anti-austerity opinions.


Tory MP and Chair of the Health Select Committee in the House of Commons, Dr Sarah Wollaston, warned that the pay cap has had a ‘significant impact on morale’ in the health service and that it is time to ‘think again’.


A sentiment echoed by former Tory minister Andrew Murrison, who said:


"It is absolutely right we should now be looking at removing that cap on pay for public sector workers."
 
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Brigadier said:
My b-i-l is a full-time firefighter, who also has a second job. It is common among his colleagues.
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There is no Law that states people cannot have more than one job,
So long as a Firefighter does not work prior to going on duty and cannot cope because he is tired and unfit it is acceptable,
Turn it around the other way Retained /Part Time Firefighters have a main job, Firefighting is their secondary job.
The same with most Coastguards the majority are also Part Time.
 
No, but it is only because they have so much free-time that they have the time for second jobs.

Do you?
 
EFLImpudence said:
No, but it is only because they have so much free-time that they have the time for second jobs.

Do you?
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They work shifts. If there hours of work are more concentrated that doesn't mean they have more free time than someone whose hours are more spread out.
 
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motorbiking said:
If the grass in the private sector is greener, then they can leave and work there, assuming they have the skills and attitudes required.
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motorbiking said:
If they can fill the vacancies, with good people, with current packages (and a quick search says they can),
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Well you have another logic fail. You argue Public sector pay is so good then people will leave the private sector to move into the public sector. You also add if pay isn't good then employers must pay more.

You have just argued against your own point. Well done that is some achievement.
 
Kankerot said:
They work shifts. If there hours of work are more concentrated that doesn't mean they have more free time than someone whose hours are more spread out.
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Obviously that is true, mathematically unless they do fewer hours than someone else.

However, I believe their shift arrangements are such that they might do something like four days on and four days off.

That therefore does give them more free time at useful times of the day than someone working 9 - 5 five (or five and a half) days a week.

Plus, without detracting from their occasional heroics, a lot of their time is spent waiting around and not using a lot of energy.
 
EFLImpudence said:
Obviously that is true, mathematically unless they do fewer hours than someone else.

However, I believe their shift arrangements are such that they might do something like four days on and four days off.

That therefore does give them more free time at useful times of the day than someone working 9 - 5 five (or five and a half) days a week.

Plus, without detracting from their occasional heroics, a lot of their time is spent waiting around and not using a lot of energy.
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Which is the nature of the job. Fires are not predictable by their nature.

The problem I have with the notion that they are sitting around waiting conjures up the idea they are getting paid to sit around which leads onto the suggestion all we need is a system to call them in when needed. The nature of emergency response is just that an emergency response in a short time, not lets ring people and see who can make it in the next 5 minutes.

There has been too much management kool-aid being drunk that we can transform public services if we think of them like production lines or manufacturing problems. I have sat through many of these meetings pointing out how stupid some of the suggestions become.
 
Bosswhite said:
There is no Law that states people cannot have more than one job,
So long as a Firefighter does not work prior to going on duty and cannot cope because he is tired and unfit it is acceptable,
Turn it around the other way Retained /Part Time Firefighters have a main job, Firefighting is their secondary job.
The same with most Coastguards the majority are also Part Time.
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I didn't say it was. I was merely adding a personal account, which I know to be true, to help debate on a factual basis.
 
Brigadier said:
I didn't say it was. I was merely adding a personal account, which I know to be true, to help debate on a factual basis.
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Many people work in their spare time, and have a second/third income,
Ex Chancellor George Osborne has just landed a sixth job ( its called Multi Tasking )
 
My bil was due to retire from the council 2 years ago,a month before his retirement the council made him redundant as a result of a cost cutting exercise.
He came out with a 5 figure redundancy payout, and 1 month later rightly got his pension with another lump sum.
Would this have happened in the private industry, no bl**dy chance.
Apparently this is quite a normal procedure for councils to act like this, its been agreed with the unions.
After all it's only the rate payers money and the same rules will apply to them when its their turn.
 
anobium said:
My bil was due to retire from the council 2 years ago,a month before his retirement the council made him redundant as a result of a cost cutting exercise.
He came out with a 5 figure redundancy payout, and 1 month later rightly got his pension with another lump sum.
Would this have happened in the private industry, no bl**dy chance.
Apparently this is quite a normal procedure for councils to act like this, ts been agreed with the unions.
After all it's only the rate payers money and the same rules will apply to them when its their turn.
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So you want employers to act like Philip Green? There are great private sector employers -I suggest you find one.

Or are you arguing we must lower our standards to the lowest level employer and race to the bottom.
 
Kankerot said:
So you want employers to act like Philip Green? There are great private sector employers -I suggest you find one.
Or are you arguing we must lower our standards to the lowest level employer and race to the bottom.
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What has that to do with the clearly ridiculous or fraudulent procedure carried out by a council?
 
Kankerot said:
So you want employers to act like Philip Green? There are great private sector employers -I suggest you find one.

Or are you arguing we must lower our standards to the lowest level employer and race to the bottom.
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Do u work for the council?
What is good for the public sector should also apply to the private sector.
What about the redundancy payments, the basic maximum is around £8k but name me a public sector employer who ever paid that.
Again one rule for public sector workers and one for the rest of us.
 
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