chimney removed upstairs, joist not supported

[skhudy]

Im replacing a ceiling downstairs where a chimney has been tajen out in the past. Taking the ceiling down i can see a joist either side of the old chimney breast is not supported so 2 of the joists above don't have appropriate support.

The 3x3 which used to rest on the chimney, supporting the 2 joists now rests on nothing.

Any sensible way to support this without disturbing the room above?

 

[oldbutnotdead]

Some sleeve bolts through that 3 x 3 into the wall would help- may already have been done (that bit of 3 x 3 must have been added after the chimney breast was removed). Is it supporting more chimney upstairs?

 

[ree]

Why not post pics showing the area in context, & pics of the room above?

Has the chimney breast been taken out up to and including the stack?

 

[skhudy]

There is no chimney breast above, the stack is supported in the loft.the room upstairs is pretty full and a pic wouldnt show anything ysefull

A better pic is attached.

The joist against the wall are 7x2 resting on 3x3 Which is unsupported. Just the 2 7x2 bits through the middle are newer timbers

Sleeve bolts is a good idea in the 7x2 against the wall and provide some support and secure the 3x3 and newer bit of 7x2 into that, how are they fitted? I assume its pretty straight forward - anything to watch out for? (Im a diyer never used them)

Untitled

• skhudy
• 11 Feb 2015
• 1

 

[oldbutnotdead]

Sleeve bolts are fab things- drill straight through timber, swap drill bit for masonry, keep drilling til you're at the correct depth, shove bolt in, tighten up. If you've got a gap between timber and wall then you need to back the gap (otherwise tightening the bolt will deform the timber.

But they're not going to help in that setup- your alternative photo shows more useful detail.

The new bits of 7 x 2 are supported by the 3 x 3 trimmers. The end inside the room is (presumably) fixed to the original 7 x 2 so supported there. Question is the ends of the 3 x 3s at the wall- are they pocketed into the wall or are they fixed to the original 7 x 2? Either way it is those ends that need support.

It almost looks as if the 3 x 3 is sitting on a step in the brickwork- if it is then as long as nothing moves you'll be fine (it can't fall away, there's a 7 x 2 and a load of floorboards holding it there).

You might want to screw (or spike) through the 3 x 3s and into the dark 7 x 2s (which look as if they're fixed to the wall). Anything more than that is going to be awkward or messy (you could fix a piece of angle iron to the wall so it supports the wall ends of the 3 x 3s but that's a bit overkill)

Have a good look at the wall ends of the 3 x 3s and see if they are set in the wall or spiked to those 7 x 2s before you start hitting things

 

[skhudy]

Unfortunately the trimmers are not sitting on anything or in a pocket in the wall. I assume it used to rest on the brickwork of the removed chimney breast.

If I push / pull the trimmers up there is movement with all the joists.

I think I'll have to give it a go with these sleeve bolts in the 7x2 against the wall (there is a small gap I'll pack) and the screw through the 3x3 into the 7x2 I use the sleeve bolts in so the 2nd joist across has better support

These old houses - nothing is straight forward! (especially when you uncover a previous bodge job)

 

[ree]

You could chisel out a shallow notch on the 3" x 3" and support it with an angle bracket - the leg fixed to the wall. The notch will enable the angle bracket to sit flush.

All other doubtful wood to wood connections could be screw tied-in with angle plates.

 

[oldbutnotdead]

If those 7 x 2s against the wall are floating in the breeze then yes fix them then screw/spike the 3 x 3s to them- that'll stiffen the job up a bit. If you can, get the holes for the sleeve bolts centred within a brick (rather than near the edge and definitely not in the mortar course).

If there's any sag in that floor at the moment (run a spirit level across and see if there's a dip- if you don't have a level then a long piece of string will show it) you might want to jack the timbers up so they're level (ish) before you fix them. And jack will do it just fine if you have a friend (car jack, bit of 3 x 3 the right length, friend holds the 3 s 3 vertical otherwise it might get a wobble on and drop out while you're drilling).