Creating Open Plan ground floor - fire safety regs?

[rj202283]

Hi All

I am in the process of buying a small 2 storey end terrace cottage. The upstairs consists of two bedrooms only. The ground floor has a bathroom at the rear connected to a kitchen in the middle and then a previously opened up living/dining room at the front. The front door opens directly into the living space. The staircase also opens out into this space.

I'd like to create one large Kitchen/dining/living space by removing the load bearing dividing wall between the kitchen and the living/dining space. This will result in the stairs being open to the kitchen.

Can anyone please clarify the fire safety requirements in this scenario where it's a two storey house but no protected route of escape on the ground floor? I've read contradictory info on this. I'm currently investigating the installation of a misting system in the hope that this would suffice from a BC PoV. Also, both bedrooms have escape windows.

And on a side note, does the installation of an RSJ across my property (to replace the dividing wall) require a party wall agreement with next door?

Any help for a newbie much appreciated!

 

[oldbutnotdead]

Can't help with the fire safety stuff. The rsj install- depends if you're leaving nibs of the wall or not. If you plan to pocket the rsj into the party wall(s) then yes pwa will apply. If you leave 150mm nibs either side (so rsj doesn't go into party wall and is a lot easier to install) then I believe you can swerve pwa. Check with building control- it's notifiable whichever way you do it

 

[rj202283]

Can't help with the fire safety stuff. The rsj install- depends if you're leaving nibs of the wall or not. If you plan to pocket the rsj into the party wall(s) then yes pwa will apply. If you leave 150mm nibs either side (so rsj doesn't go into party wall and is a lot easier to install) then I believe you can swerve pwa. Check with building control- it's notifiable whichever way you do it

Makes sense! As the section of the wall intersecting with my neighbour is at the bottom of stairs, having a 150mm nib there wont be an issue. Ideally I can avoid having the nib on the opposite side which intersects with an external wall to fully open up the remaining space...will certainly check with BC though.

Thanks!

 

[^woody^]

A protected route is not required in a two-storey house. As long as there is a door to outside in the room at the bottom of the stairs, which there will be, it will comply.

However, you may want to ensure the fire detection system is suitable, probably an L2 standard.

 

[rj202283]

A protected route is not required in a two-storey house. As long as there is a door to outside in the room at the bottom of the stairs, which there will be, it will comply.

However, you may want to ensure the fire detection system is suitable, probably an L2 standard.

Thanks for this, really appreciate the advice. Based on various discussions with different BCO's today it seems there's a preference to have some kind of fire suppression system in place on the groundfloor combined with viable escape windows on the first floor. Good news is, it's seems it's doable at least! Just a matter of how much it's going to cost me. I've been quoted £3.5k for a misting system!

 

[Nakajo]

Which system? A 'double-knock' one?

 

[rj202283]

Which system? A 'double-knock' one?

I've enquired about imist and Plumis. Both quotes included 2 sensors on the ground floor. Are you able to give a recommendation? Thanks

 

[Diver Fred]

Ask yourself what you are going to gain apart from cooking smells & deposits of cooking grease, increased condensation, noise from the washing machine and the like throughout the house.
You have quite an open plan house already so why bother?

 

[rj202283]

Ask yourself what you are going to gain apart from cooking smells & deposits of cooking grease, increased condensation, noise from the washing machine and the like throughout the house.
You have quite an open plan house already so why bother?

I get where you're coming from but I've spent the last 5yrs in a similar setup and have become accustomed to this type of plan and style of living. I bought this property with a view to maintaining it if I can. I've tried to address the washing machine issue by adding the utility cupboard between the kitchen and bathroom and am hoping some acoustic insuslation will help with that too. And from a purely practical PoV, I have a very young son and would like to be able to be in the kitchen and keep a close eye on him both at the same time.

All that being said, I have been considering including the option of closing off the kitchen with a telescopic pocket door or bifolds but even if I do, the fire reg question would still stand as I can't afford fire rated glass and there are no fire rated telescopic pocket doors on the market.

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

Single and double are available: https://www.eclisse.co.uk/fire-rated/

 

[Nakajo]

I've enquired about imist and Plumis. Both quotes included 2 sensors on the ground floor. Are you able to give a recommendation? Thanks

Imist relies on a frangible bulb, which I imagine means there could be a significant build up of smoke before activation. Plumis is heat *and smoke* activated (but not by burnt toast), so this would be my preference.

 

[Diver Fred]

All that being said, I have been considering including the option of closing off the kitchen with a telescopic pocket door or bifolds but even if I do, the fire reg question would still stand as I can't afford fire rated glass and there are no fire rated telescopic pocket doors on the market.

Just a thought - have you considered having an internal window in the existing wall rather than demolishing the wall? It is what we have in our house (our lounge would have been very dark without it). it works very well, has the benefits of open plan without the disadvantages.

 

[foxhole]

Ask yourself what you are going to gain apart from cooking smells & deposits of cooking grease, increased condensation, noise from the washing machine and the like throughout the house.
You have quite an open plan house already so why bother?

Kitchen extraction prevents the problem of condensation. Correctly installed washing machine makes little noise.