DNO, meter and earthing

[BeeLZeebub]

When we first moved into our house two years ago, the first thing I did was tape-up the cover on our main fuse as one third of it was dangling off it!!! Despite the fact I also noticed there was no main bonding, I am ashamed to admit that I'm only now getting around to sorting it all out

Three questions:

1) Should the DNO be my first port of call in remedying the fuse cover? Have they any obligation to assist? More worryingly, you can see from the second pic that bare wire is showing on the tails as they head into the meter. Is this something they would consider as a matter of some urgency, or am I flapping unnecessarily?

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• BeeLZeebub
• 27 Sep 2013
• 1

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• BeeLZeebub
• 27 Sep 2013
• 1

2) The third pic shows that some sort of metal bracket is acting as the main earthing point (btw is this a TNS system?), and it all looks pretty shoddy. I am getting our consumer unit replaced very soon (old Wylex, no RCDs) so I could ask for a tidy up to be part of the job or is this again within the remit of the DNO?

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• BeeLZeebub
• 27 Sep 2013
• 1

3) As I mentioned and as you can see, there is no main bonding (the green/yellow earth wire goes to the meter): I figured I could do the cabling (not the fixing) to save on cost, but I'm aware that it might be more involved than I think. If it were simple I wouldn't even propose this, but the gas meter sits outside and is on the opposite side of the house; the water supply is lead piping (sufficiently furry inside so as not to pose a risk we've been told) and only emerges to connect to copper piping in a damn awkward location - it might seriously bump up a spark's bill!!

Any thoughts appreciated

 

[bernardgreen]

1) Should the DNO be my first port of call in remedying the fuse cover?

The DNO is yourONLY port of call for the main fuse cover.

 

[westie101]

The DNO will change the cut-out as it is their property & responsibility, at the same time the shoiuld re-make the earth connection to the cable sheath to an earth terminal (you may need to suppy that).
The bare wire they may remedy at the same time.

Contact them & report the broken cut-out & exposed wires

 

[MeterMonkey]

The supplier is responsible for the meter tails.

Contact the DNO regarding the cover, then contact supplier regarding live copper showing on underside of the meter.

 

[plugwash]

AIUI the incoming tails to the meter are the responsibility of the electricity supplier but the outgoing tails are the responsibility of the customer.

The live copper on the meter tails in your picture seems to be mostly a result of cramming too many tails into the meter output terminals. The tails also seem to be a bit on the thin side.

I suspect if you get a pair of henly blocks and some new tails ready the DNO guy will connect them up to the meter for you while he has the power disconnected to replace the cutout.

 

[JohnD]

I would tend to put a 100A DP isolator with 25mm tails close to the meter, feeding Henleys which you can then connect the CUs to afterwards. Then the meterman will not need to wait until you've finished; and you certainly should not be waving live tails around.

some suppliers will provide an isolator if you are very lucky.

My preference is for the MEM isolator whch has a removable hatch for the outgoing terminals so you don't need to expose the supply terminals. There may be a better or more rigid enclosure that does the same thing.

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You are not supposed to fix things to the meter board but they don't seem to mind an isolator, MET or Henleys. You can mount a separate board if you want. Kitchen worktop offcuts are very good as the surface is flameproof and easy to keep clean. You can space it off the wall by putting the screws through the plastic caps of soft-drink bottles if you want to.

 

[BeeLZeebub]

Thanks very much for all your advice guys - will help a lot in planning pre DNO call - cheers

 

[MeterMonkey]

If your supplier is BG, and you call us out and we would probably stick a new meter on the wall (dumb, not smart) and add some blocks to correctly sort out your wiring. There should not be a charge for this.

 

[BeeLZeebub]

The live copper on the meter tails in your picture seems to be mostly a result of cramming too many tails into the meter output terminals. The tails also seem to be a bit on the thin side.

I suspect if you get a pair of henly blocks and some new tails ready the DNO guy will connect them up to the meter for you while he has the power disconnected to replace the cutout.

Actually, Plugwash - may I just clarify (excuse my ignorance, if you will) ... that your advice is to reduce the bunching of cables at the meter's output? Namely, one 'tail' from the output side of the meter could feed a Henley block (to be positioned just below) and from there, one tail feeds the meter and the two other tails could go on to their destinations**? If so, what spec Henley bloc to I need (sorry, dumb question perhaps, but better safe n all that) - would this suffice? http://www.amazon.co.uk/CLICK-HENLEY-BLOCK-METER-TAILS/dp/B007X4QM2Q).

And tails: say, this http://www.screwfix.com/p/prysmian-...16mm-1m-reel-double-insulated-pack-of-3/79213

** The two other red cables/tails .... one does feed what appears to be a isolation switch on the left of the board (sorry this wasn’t pertinent to my initial questions so didn’t mention it); if so then this will still need a separate feed from the output side wont it, bypassing the Henley block?
The other tail appears to feed, well, I'm not sure - looks like an old cut out ... will try and provide pics (am at work at present).

Thanks in advance for your time

 

[MeterMonkey]

That Henley block would be fine, BeeL.

The cable on the other hand might not be, depending on the size of the main fuse the DNO put into the new cutout, or what is in the existing cutout.

100amp - minimum of 25mm meter tails
80amp - minimum of 16mm
60amp - minimum of 10mm

You are likely to have an 80 amp fuse in the current cutout.

 

[BeeLZeebub]

That Henley block would be fine, BeeL.

The cable on the other hand might not be, depending on the size of the main fuse the DNO put into the new cutout, or what is in the existing cutout.

100amp - minimum of 25mm meter tails
80amp - minimum of 16mm
60amp - minimum of 10mm

You are likely to have an 80 amp fuse in the current cutout.

Thanks BG. Not to pre-empt Plugwash's response, but did I get the right end of the stick (as to what he was suggesting)? One tail from output to the Henley block, three then distributing it ... one to meter, two elsewhere .. proviso being one might feed a switch directly from output?

Will the (broken) fuse cover tell me its size?

Again, thanks in advance - sorry for all the Qs - keen to learn !

 

[MeterMonkey]

fuse rating is on the fuse its self, So Just leave it until the DNo arrive.

I created a picture to show you how to rectify the problem

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• MeterMonkey
• 30 Sep 2013
• 1

The size of your cabling and because it is single insulated cables mean that It not longer meets the requirements.

as you can see from the very professional image I created.

You'll need either 25mm or 16mm cables coming from the cutout to the meter, meter to isolator and then from isolator to the Henley block/s the Henley blocks is where your current red wires would be connected.

Your supplier has a responsibility for the safety of the electric meter, As I said, if your supplier is BG, the work would be carried out for free. I can speak for other suppliers.

 

[securespark]

If your supplier is BG, and you call us out and we would probably stick a new meter on the wall (dumb, not smart) and add some blocks to correctly sort out your wiring. There should not be a charge for this.

That's interesting, Jack.

IME, BG don't supply and fit henleys in this situation.

Things are replaced as is.

 

[BeeLZeebub]

Thans BG - you're a star Tony Hart had nothing on you

 

[BeeLZeebub]

For those interested (?!), I have an update to this already ...

Phoned the DNO today, circa 2pm. The very nice laydeee informed me that as it wasnt an emergency as such, so it wouldn't be a priority job. Ok fair enough, give it a fortnight me thinks ..... 10 mins ago (i.e. 1630), the wife informs me there's a sparky looking at the meter!!!

Anyway, per Plugwash's assessment, too many output cables caused the exposed wiring. One of the tails went to an old isolation switch that wasnt wired up (!); the other went to an c. 1930s cut out (the object I couldnt identify). Both removed, so no Henley block needed. Guy did the job, again as Plugwash suggested he might, despite the output side not being the DNOs responsibility. Said it was a "matter of ethics"!!

(Oh and it was a 60 amp looped-in, looped-out supply ("you're lucky to have an earth ... the rest of the road havent" .... )

Seriously impressed